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This is still a draft now final but can still be updated to accommodate new info. Please help me refine the terminology, and let me know if I have forgotten anything that has to be included. Common Terminology Tigers, Crystals and Taiwan Bees will all breed together. Here are some common terms or names that are used in the Shrimp hobby to describe various shrimp. The following picture from rah-bop will paint a better image as we go through the descriptions. Refer back to this picture as you read the descriptions. (Click to expand) What is a Tibee? A tibee is a hybrid between any Tiger (OEBT - orange eye blue tiger or also blonde tiger) - and usually a Taiwan Bee (TB) OR can also be hybrid between any Tiger and Crystals - CBS (Crystal Black Shrimp) and CRS (Crystal Red Shrimp). The preference is to cross with a Taiwan Bee. Since TBs are rarer and more expensive, you might not have enough TBs to breed. Using a Tiger as a partner to the Taiwan Bee, will ensure some genes are carried over when you cross the Tibee back with the Taiwan Bee parent. It's offspring could yield some Taiwan Bees. Crystals are more common. So a Tibee from TigerXCrystal is not as sought after. But nature can throw up some amazing colours from this hybrid too. I am working on a TigerXCRS myself to try to get some Red Tiger tibees. What is a TaiTibee? A Taitibee is a Tibee crossed back with a Taiwan Bee. What is a Pinto? A Pinto is a colour variation and type of Taitibee. There are 3 variants of patterns: Spotted Head Zebra Fancy - Such as skunk pattern and cloud patterns. The creative name for skunk pattern is derived from the black-and-white pattern, which very much resembles that of a skunk, especially due to the pattern on the head. And as the name suggests, the Cloud pattern very much resembles clouds shapes on the head of the shrimp. Colouration of pintos generally come in either black or red base. Black Zebra Pinto Red Zebra Pinto Cloud Pinto Skunk Pinto What is a Mischling? Mischling is a German word for "crossbreed" (plural: Mischlinge). A mischling (in the shrimp hobby) is a hybrid cross between Crystals and Taiwan Bees. When this crossbred mischling is crossed with another CRS, it's genetics are diluted, and you get a small % of Taiwan Bees. When mischlings are crossed with another mischling it's genetics are even more diluted. And the % of TB are even smaller to the point of never getting a TB. It's like striking Lotto. However, when you cross a mischling back with a Taiwan Bee, you get a larger % of TBs, but with the added benefit of strengthening it's gene pool when it's original parents were mixed with a CRS. BlueBolts has already started an excellent sticky thread on Mischling here: http://shrimpkeepersforum.com/forum/index.php/topic/714-minchlings/ This article is a supplement to information already on SKF. It is by no means trying to supersede any information found elsewhere. Here is an excellent explanation from Ineke as well “Taiwan Bees crossed with Crystals give Mischlings which are then crossed back to Taiwan Bees to help people get to their goals quicker in having more Taiwan Bees (TB) however on this forum we like to let people know when Mischling bloodlines appear in our breeding so more initials are added. If you get a King Kong (KK) Bluebolt (BB), Panda or any other TB from a TB/ Mischling cross we like to let people know by saying we have a KK(TBM)-King Kong from TB / Mischling. If you are lucky enough to get a TB. From 2 Mischlings it would be a KK (TBMM) or whatever type of TB you have. This just keeps people honest and let's buyers know that they will get a percentage of Mischlings from their TBM / TBMM. Nothing worse than having Mischlings showing up in your TB. Breeding program when you thought you had purebreds". What is a Tibee cross Mischling? To my knowledge, this has not been given a common name yet. It's still a Caridina Cantonensis. It's still a bee shrimp. It is just a different colour variant. Let's call this variant a "Tischling" for now (03Oct2014), unless someone can confirm a common name that pre-dates this name. This Tischling is an uncommon hybrid, possibly because the desirable genetic traits are too diluted and takes the shrimp keeper further away from achieving desirable goals. Not when there are easier and faster breeding choices that would achieve the same goal. Like for instances, using the Tibee or Mischling to be crossed back to a pure Tiger, Crystal or Taiwan Bee. A hybrid Mischling might carry recessive traits, and is unseen (like a specific colour), and crossing it with another hybrid Tibee would be like trying to get a certain colour (say red), from something that doesn't show any colour. A complete guess.
Do pinto breed true?
sky99 posted a topic in Caridina logemanniHello everyone! I bought some pintos, and i did put them with my other bees (some panda, some king kong, some blue bolts). However, i can't seem to find if pintos do breed true (in that case, should i separate them? or will those mix with the others to make cool new paterns, colors, etc?) I have a hard time figuring what bee breed true if any. I've read that bee are a mutation of CRS/CBS, but do they produce similar offsprings or is it more random as an interaction of multiple genes? Thanks in advance for the help!
Some of my PINTO mix :)
Shrimp Farm posted a topic in Taiwan Bee Shrimp - Caridina mariae x logemanniHello guys. I'd like to share some of my Pinto mix. Hope that U like them. Plis tell me aswell should I start as a part of my chanel english version :)
hihat posted a topic in Taiwan Bee Shrimp - Caridina mariae x logemanniI got some nice specimen from my mix-aquarium with TB's, pinto's, taitibees etc, etc, The first 2 photos (I think) must be a mix from a pinto zebra and a kingkong, The red one is probably a red tiger and the same father? I've got 2 of the blacks and about 10 of the red ones, I have put them apart from the rest and see what the next genereation will be. Sorry for the quality of the photo's, they're just from my iPhone, the macrolens I ordered hasn't arrived yet :-( Greetings from the Netherlands
Shrimp newbie advise
st4tic posted a topic in General Questions/DiscussionsHey all I am new to the shrimp thing and am a bit confused by a few things. But first a bit about what I have and want to achieve. I am looking at keeping Crystal Reds and Blacks and as my confidence increases trying for a few different types like Hulks and Blue Bolts and maybe a selective breeding program. I have a cycled rack with 5 tanks ( 4 x 3ft and 1 x 5ft) a common sump (3ft with normal media and a 10000 l/h pump with return so pressure isn't through the roof) and sponge filters for each of the 5 tanks. It has a 300w heater but I am thinking of adding a second 200w just in case of a problem. Will this be ok for the above shrimp or stop the sump and just use the sponges? And now for my newbie questions and things I would like clarified. - Pinto's are a hybrid shrimp of tigers and bees bred for specific patterns or is there something more complicated happening? - Can you have mishlings and end up with a few different bee type shrimp after breeding. ie 2 x mishlings bred and offspring could be KK or Hulk or Panda (or any others) depending on genes? - Can you ever breed true bees from mishlings? - When doing water changes do you gravel vac the substrate or just top up water? - I was planning to have the tanks bare with mosses and plants in pots to help with cleaning will this be ok? - I am using rain water it has a 6.8 PH, 0 KH and I don't have a test kit for TDS and GH is it necessary to have these tests and will I need something to buffer the water and keep the PH lower like ADA soil? - (I have read if KH and PH are low you cannot have a high TDS????) - Can you get Crystal Blues, Greens or Oranges and what is the difference between Pandas and Crystal Black is it just a slight colour difference? Please forgive any obviously silly questions as I have searched a lot on the net and confused myself with different information. I am also wanting to minimise any deaths so have not bought any shrimp yet until I am satisfied I know enough and can achieve what I would like to. Any extra advise would be appreciated thanks for the help and if you need any more information about my setup or anything let me know sorry again if anything seems obvious. Cheers :)