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Went back home to feed my shrimp and top up water when to my surprise a bunch of TB shrimplets decided to go walk-abouts. At first i was like.. "Man thats a strange coloured CRS"

King Kong few weeks old.

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RR few days old

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RR few weeks with RR few days

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RR

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RR

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Oh yeah! They look fantastic. Such great colour for such a small size.

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It was a small win. Very unexpected because you know... my condition arnt prime apparently. Its great to see everyone in my circle having such great success of late. The RRs ill raise a few more weeks and give to Davin to help fuel his program. As much as id love to see a tank full of them im just not ready yet. My holiday break is coming up in the new few weeks and fingers crossed ill get something amazing setup in my apartment. Once ive got tanks here itll be full steam ahead with the tibees.

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congratulations on your first mishling babies, just be sure that who ever you sell the babies to understands

that they are not pure blood and are born from mishlings.

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Could be pure blood. My kk girl recently reberried so we'll have to wait and see I guess.

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congratulations on your first mishling babies' date=' just be sure that who ever you sell the babies to understands

that they are not pure blood and are born from mishlings.[/quote']

Hey Dean, if a breeder is also a seller, are you saying they should keep the TB's from Michlings separate from TB xTB babies? That means a different tank and not everyone has that luxury??

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I think it is important that people be made aware what they are buying.

If someone breeds mishlings and gets a few tb from them they need to be honest enough

to inform people that they are from mishlings and not pure TB blood lines.

There is enough dishonesty in this hobby with everyone trying to make a quick buck and misleading up and coming breeders of what they are spending there hard earned $ on.

Any TB born from mishling should be sold as that and is not worth the $ of full blood TB.

Mishling TB should be kept in a different tank from full blood as they are not true TB.

If you are buying Any TB from a breeder then always do your research and make sure they can prove

What they are selling is infact what they claim.

Ask to see the parents and a photo of parents and babies all in 1 tank if you have doubts.

Every good breeder usually documents there success with photos and has plenty of threads showing the success

Of there breeding programs from start until present. They don't just appear from nowhere.

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Hi Dean,

If Mischling TB breeds TBs, are they considered pure? or how many generations it will take so we can call them true TB.

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Good question Ace, but not a question i can answer 100% correctly.

it has many variables to this answer. i know from experience only that, it depends on the strength of the crystal gene in the TB mish.

I have some TB mish that are 3rd gen that still product crystal babies and i have some 2nd gen that dont produce any!

All i can suggest is that you keep any mishling TB program in a separate tank and continue breeding them and selling them for what they are..

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How many generations after, say a pair of mishling KK's, breed 100% KK's each generation would be a safe number? :encouragement:

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This is one I've spent some time thinking about myself. As Dean says there are a lot of factors involved here. And what is a Mishling? You can almost go as far as to

ask what is a King Kong? What is a Ruby Red? I suspect it may be possible to get to a stage of lets say an F8 Mishling that has the genetics to throw TBs everytime,

or even the opposite a King Kong that only throws Mishlings. I think provided you're straight up with the buyer when selling its not an issue. For me its been a case

of getting the genes in the first place, that was goal one. Now its selectively breed, cull, bred some more and cull and see what comes through. When it comes to

genetics its primarily about percentages and then you'll find one that breaks all the rules. The one time where we really love those that defy the odds and the rules.

Mutations and evolution make Shrimp Keeping fun, not so much the development of MTS though.

Like Dean says this becomes more and more important with more people coming into TBs, especially if you're buying. Do research the seller, do you trust them? Are

they happy to show you pictures? Or are they a fly-by-nighter? How long have they been around? And be honest yourself when selling, its important. I always advise

people that if they're not sure then don't buy, have done that when people have come to visit and buy my shrimp. If somebody wasn't sure they wanted something

due to a sporatic purchase I've always advised them to go away, think about it and come back but ONLY if they really want it. Its a lost sale but I'd rather have

a happy customer, and another friend.

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again im not 100% sure from my own breeding yet. but i would say if you can get 2 generations breeding 100% true then you are on your way i guess.

But keep in mind each generation is no less than 3-4 months breeding work.

so as a time guide this is a good example of average times.

F2 = 6-8 months breeding,

F3 = 9-12 months breeding,

F4 = 12-16 months breeding,

etc etc

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How many generations after' date=' say a pair of mishling KK's, breed 100% KK's each generation would be a safe number? :encouragement:[/quote']

Thats a loaded question, how long is a piece of string? It really depends on the genetics. Unless you're breeding them yourself and keeping good records you

really don't know how many generations from when they started breeding true. And what is the percentage size for your sample? Is it 5 shrimplets, 100

shrimplets or 500 shrimplets? I think for most people the numbers are too small, especially as most of us wouldn't really want to cull a KK would we as it only

throws KKs say 20% of the time. Do you keep or cull?

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again im not 100% sure from my own breeding yet. but i would say if you can get 2 generations breeding 100% true then you are on your way i guess.

so as a time guide this is a good example of average times.

F2 = 6-8 months breeding' date='

F3 = 9-12 months breeding,

F4 = 12-16 months breeding,

[/quote']

Thats exactly the reason why I love buying Dean's and Marcus's F3/F4 Mishlings, theres a serious amount of time been put into

developing their strains hence $25 for an F3 or F4 mishling I consider an absolute steal! Think about the amount of tank space

and time you would need to get through to the same level from a CRS and a Ruby Red through to that stage. Well worth it!

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Thats exactly the reason why I love buying Dean's and Marcus's F3/F4 Mishlings' date=' theres a serious amount of time been put into

developing their strains hence $25 for an F3 or F4 mishling I consider an absolute steal! Think about the amount of tank space

and time you would need to get through to the same level from a CRS and a Ruby Red through to that stage. Well worth it![/quote']

Now you got 50+ of those mishlings! >_

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Now you got 50+ of those mishlings! >_<

Hell yes!

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Now you got 50+ of those mishlings! >_<

Another rack is in order I think Davin! Oh and congratulations Robert! Very geneous of you to be "GIVING" them to Davin!

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That's entirely the reason I'm asking & why I have started my own mishling line so I know what F number I have & where they came from. I will soon have the tanks to run with these lines properly so I can explore the results of these genetic inconsistencies for myself &, just quietly, I'm really excited about it. :victorious: I'm not out to make money, just to improve the general quality of Australian shrimp & to answer your earlier question BigD, Yes I would cull a KK that is only producing 20% KK & 80% mishlings if I had others that were producing 100% KK :encouragement:

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to answer your earlier question BigD' date=' Yes I would cull a KK that is only producing 20% KK & 80% mishlings if I had others that were producing 100% KK :encouragement:[/quote']

I'll give your unwanted KK a home ;)

20% KK is better than no KK in my eyes lol

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Another rack is in order I think Davin! Oh and congratulations Robert! Very geneous of you to be "GIVING" them to Davin!
Giving may not be the right word LOL But I'm sure Robert and I will work something out.
That's entirely the reason I'm asking & why I have started my own mishling line so I know what F number I have & where they came from. I will soon have the tanks to run with these lines properly so I can explore the results of these genetic inconsistencies for myself &' date=' just quietly, I'm really excited about it. :victorious: I'm not out to make money, just to improve the general quality of Australian shrimp & to answer your earlier question BigD, Yes I would cull a KK that is only producing 20% KK & 80% mishlings if I had others that were producing 100% KK :encouragement:[/quote']I'm doing the same Squiggle and I agree with you. I hate having to cull but I was also slack on a tank of Sunkists where I didn't cull and the difference ascompared with the Sunkists/Pumpkin tank is quite substantial. So yeah, I cull, just don't like it. And if a KK is only throwing 20% KK and 80% mishling I'd alsotry a different male with the KK to confirm before culling. But yeah, if thats what she does then yeah, it has to be done to improve the lines overall. Its thehaving others producing 100% though thats the hard part, and being able to get the numbers so you're happy to cull. With my blues I did a lot of culling butonly after I had a large base to select from, I then took about a dozen from the 90 or so I had and worked on those. The rest either got feed to my betta'sand some got cooked and then fed back to the remaining shrimp.
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I'll give your unwanted KK a home ;)

Yes torface, send them to my home. Lol

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  • HOF Member

Well said all the hardest part is the culling but if you want to improve the shrimp genetics it needs to be done. When I bred guinea pigs I was lucky to get 1 good colour, confirmation etc out of maybe fifty when I first started and it took a bit longer than shrimp to perfect what I wanted but in the long run they were breeding true and winning prizes. It's the hard yard to start that makes it all worth while in the end plus honesty that is so important! Well done for sticking to your plans.:encouragement:

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I'll give your unwanted KK a home ;)

20% KK is better than no KK in my eyes lol

Jeez Tor, I haven't even bred them yet, that sort of thing is at least a year or two away, hahaha :encouragement:

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