Jump to content

Dean's (Ec) vs BlueBolts (TDS)

BlueBolts

By BlueBolts,
in Shrimp Health & Care

 Share

Recommended Posts

BlueBolts Shrimp Guru

BlueBolts

Posted
Posted

Dean's uses Ec & I use TDS to calculate the purity of our water. There's a mix of information and reference to water quality using Ec & TDS, and I appreciate many hobbyist maybe confused to which "pen" to buy, or if they've already bought a TDS pen, regret the fact as reference is made to Ec ....

Please take note of the bold words/sentences ....

Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) is the best measurement of the nutrient concentration of a hydroponic solution. To estimate TDS, one can use a meter that measures the Electric Conductivity (EC) of a solution, and convert the number to TDS in parts per million (ppm). Many meters will do this conversion.

Total dissolved solids (TDS) is typically expressed in parts per million (ppm).

Electrical Conductivity (EC) is expressed in siemens per centimeter (s/cm) or milliseimens per centimeter(ms/cm).

For convenience, EC measurements often are converted to TDS units (ppm) by the meter.

The meter cannot directly measure TDS as described above, and instead uses a linear conversion factor to calculate it.

The meter uses an approximate conversion factor, because the exact composition of the mix is not known. Conversion factors range from .50 to .72, *depending on the meter manufacturer, which approximates a TDS calculation from the meter’s measurement of EC.

* All ppm pens actually measure the value based on EC and then convert the EC value to display the ppm value, having different conversion factors between differing manufacturers is why we have this problem communicating nutrient measurements between one another.

The issue is that different ppm pen manufacturers use different conversion factors to calculate the ppm they display. All ppm (TDS, Total Dissolved Solids) pens actually measure in EC or CF and run a conversion program to display the reading in ppm's.

There are three conversion factors which various manufacturers use for displaying ppm's...

USA 1 ms/cm (EC 1.0 or CF 10) = 500 ppm

European 1 ms/cm (EC 1.0 or CF 10) = 640 ppm

Australian 1 ms/cm (EC 1.0 or CF 10) = 700 ppm

For example,

Hanna, Milwaukee 1 ms/cm (EC 1.0 or CF 10) = 500 ppm

Eutech 1 ms/cm (EC 1.0 or CF 10) = 640 ppm

Truncheon 1 ms/cm (EC 1.0 or CF 10) = 700 ppm

When reporting your PPM in a thread, please give the conversion factor your meter uses. For example: 550 PPM @0.7 or give the reading in EC, which should be the same meter to meter.

SUMMARY

Although TDS also measure organics etc.... all TDS pens are manufactured to calculate the Ec, and uses a mathematical formula (factor of 0.5, 0.64 or 0.7) to convert the reading to TDS. So all we need to know is the pen's conversion factor. i.e. I have two pens, the 1st calculates Ec/TDS and uses a conversion factor of 0.5 (125 ppm = 250 ms), the 2nd calculates TDS ONLY and as it's manufactured in Europe, uses a coversion of 0.64 (160 ppm = 250 ms).

In conclusion, there's no difference whatsoever if you have a TDS or Ec pen......just need to find the right conversion factor, and apply it.

:D

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
CNgo2006 Shrimp Master

CNgo2006

Posted
Posted

Yet another informative post by the BB...I have often wondered about this and went and bought both pens.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Kitz Shrimp Lover

Kitz

Posted
Posted

Good write up bb! I think it's always good to have both pen so that you can cross check especially when you keeping expensive shrimp!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
BlueBolts Shrimp Guru

BlueBolts

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Thanks, but plagerism accounts for 50% of the article ..... my logic and understanding is good, BUT "mi englis, an discliption of werds, knot vary goed. LOL

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Squiggle Shrimp Guru

Squiggle

Posted
Posted

Awesome write up as usual BB, I think we might have another sticky :encouragement:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
CNgo2006 Shrimp Master

CNgo2006

Posted
Posted
Thanks' date=' but plagerism accounts for 50% of the article ..... my logic and understanding is good, BUT "mi englis, an discliption of werds, knot vary goed. LOL[/quote']

Takes you back to the days of school essays and assignments...Ah the good old days where you could copy from a book and not get busted because there was no internet back then...But then there would be no SKF so POO to that!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Squiggle Shrimp Guru

Squiggle

Posted
Posted
Takes you back to the days of school essays and assignments...Ah the good old days where you could copy from a book and not get busted because there was no internet back then...But then there would be no SKF so POO to that!

+1 Agree, well said dude :victorious:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • HOF Member
ineke Shrimp Guru

ineke

Posted
  • HOF Member
Posted

It's a great post and explains it well however my pen is made in china and I don't know which type it belongs to hubby thinks its an American one made in china. It is a TDS -02 any idea which I should follow.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
BlueBolts Shrimp Guru

BlueBolts

Posted
  • Author
Posted
It's a great post and explains it well however my pen is made in china and I don't know which type it belongs to hubby thinks its an American one made in china. It is a TDS -02 any idea which I should follow.

Got a pic ? Perhaps write an email to the company that you bought it from, or compare it with someone who has a Ec pen or a person with a TDS pen who knows their conversion.... It'll either by 0.5 or 0.64.... Depends which market it is made for.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • HOF Member
ineke Shrimp Guru

ineke

Posted
  • HOF Member
Posted

Pretty sure it's for America the pictures don't tell much have looked it up on google only a cheap one. I'm getting an EC pen but that's a cheap one too but thought I could take a reading from each and work it back from that - or at least Alan will:encouragement:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dean Shrimp Master

Dean

Posted
Posted

great write up Mr BB, and ill be the first to admit i DID NOT KNOW THAT :)

glad it is all clear and easy to understand now for everyone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
hoang1912 Shrimp Breeder

hoang1912

Posted
Posted

NOw I am understand what is EC and how's it work :)). Thanks BB.

BUt how can we find right conversion factor?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
BlueBolts Shrimp Guru

BlueBolts

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Check with the seller, or determine which market the pen is made for, or compare it with a Ec pen......

Link to comment
Share on other sites
hoang1912 Shrimp Breeder

hoang1912

Posted
Posted

There is no word on my pen. Only TDS, on/off and hold ;)). BUt I will ask the seller. This is a good article for a newb like me :victorious:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...
shrimpstan Shrimp Breeder

shrimpstan

Posted
Posted

u answered all my questions before i even asked. seek and u will find... at SKF!! :)

good on ya BB!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...
Foxpuppet Shrimp Breeder

Foxpuppet

Posted
Posted

Dean's (Ec) vs BlueBolts (TDS)

I'm using this pen, anyone know the conversion factor it would use?

post-1452-139909851333_thumb.jpg

It says 100 in the small writing on the LCD and 06 as the reading.

post-23-139909850151_thumb.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites
JohnH Shrimp Breeder

JohnH

Posted
Posted

600 EC is a little high if that's what it is reading. What's in your tank?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Squiggle Shrimp Guru

Squiggle

Posted
Posted

Wow 600 is a little high, around 200-300 is probably a bit better, depending on the shrimp you're keeping :encouragement:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Foxpuppet Shrimp Breeder

Foxpuppet

Posted
Posted
600 EC is a little high if that's what it is reading. What's in your tank?

I'm thinking the calibration is off somehow. Ill check some ro water this afternoon and compare. What should straight ro read?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
durro68 Shrimp Breeder

durro68

Posted
Posted

Should be close to 0. Depends on if you need to replace some of the R/O unit bits.

I just tested the water I use TDS 2 and EC 5 micro siemens

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Foxpuppet Shrimp Breeder

Foxpuppet

Posted
Posted

my Gh has been around 8-9 it's slowly crept up over the last few months, so in response to that i have been taking out 2 litres (from a 200ish litre tank) every few days and Drip replacing with RO. just checked EC and it's now at 5. i used to have a TDS pen but it went on the fritz so this pen was what i replaced it with.

the RO water tested at EC 0

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Join Our Community!

    Register today, ask questions and share your shrimp and fish tank experiences with us!

  • Must Read SKF Articles

    Shrimp Disease and Treatment
    Tibee, Taitbee, Pinto, Mischling, F1, F2

  • Tropical Fish Forum
    Discus Breeding Guide
    Discus Disease and Treatment Guide

  • Posts

    • jayc
      Inflammation of the mandibles

      By jayc · Posted

      @fred-koi, great photos. But sorry to hear you have issues with your shrimp. What shrimp is this?  It's showing signs of a bacterial infection. Are these brownish spots circled in red normally there?   How long have you had these shrimp? Bought recently? What is your water parameters like? Temperature too, please. Bacteria do better in warmer water, so make sure your tank is cooled.   Separate any shrimp that are showing signs like this shrimp - inflamed mandibles, and brown spots. If you are brave enough to want to further treat these shrimp, have a look at the treatments for "Rust Disease" in the Disease and Diagnosis thread. No guarantee we will save this shrimp, but you can give it a go.   
    • fred-koi
      Inflammation of the mandibles

      By fred-koi · Posted

      Hello, I have been experiencing a mortality problem for several months. I realize that there is a problem on the mandibles the shrimp is weak eats little then the shrimp dies. Do you have an idea ? THANK YOU
    • Avctasi
      Thinking that Crystal Shrimp isn’t right for me..

      By Avctasi · Posted

      Thank you both for your help, my newer tank that doesn’t have anything does have stratum and is heavily planted (some carpet plants like Monte Carlo, anubis, java ferns), parameters are good the only issue is the temp change.  My other tank where they are housed currently has sand, river stone pebbles, and a bunch of assorted plants (java moss, cabomba, ludwigs etc)  I haven’t thought of doing tiger shrimps but I may go into that route instead if this doesn’t work for crystals. Thank you guys again!  
    • sdlTBfanUK
      Great video from a breeder - long (30 mins) but good - Not to be watched by anyone of a nervous disposition!

      By sdlTBfanUK · Posted

      This is 'INSANE' and what happens when you get carried away in this hobby! PLEASE DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME WITHOUT CONSULTING YOUR  PSYCHIATRIST FIRST! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKH1ABcN6-g I would not want his electricity or water bills, let alone all the cost of the equipment.  
    • sdlTBfanUK
      Thinking that Crystal Shrimp isn’t right for me..

      By sdlTBfanUK · Posted

      Putting the crystal shrimp in with neocaridina (cherr) means the setup will benefit one type more than the other and it looks like the tank is better suited to neocaridina. Neocaridina are more robust anyway, caridina are a lot more sensitive and therefore harder to keep. The parameters quoted are definitely off for caridina and better suited to the neocariidina! I'm sure that that is the reason for the deaths. You shouldn't need a heater if the house sits arount 74F (and it is unlikely to get so cold that it would kill your shrimp, especially with the other heat sources in the room) and the crystals would be ok at that sort of temperature, though the 80F is getting a bit warm for them, whereas neocaridina would be less affected by that higher temperature. Of course you also need to bear in mind how hot it will get during a really hot spell as even if they are doing well normally, if you even get a few days of over 80+ (in the aquarium though, not necessarily room temperature) that could wipe them out. You could try tiger shrimps as they are almost as tough and robust as cherry shrimps and require similar water parameters, and give a bit of variety? I'm not sure that I would try the caridina in your position due to the difficulty of keeping them and the extra costs involved, when it probably won't work?  
×
×
  • Create New...