No Moulting, No Berries; Makes me a Saaaaaad Panda

[b00f]

Ok I have been doing a lot of reading relating to moulting, failed moults and everything else..

I have female CBS mischlings which have berried, but lost the babies due to hydra. Same with the CRS, yet, I have low moults and zero berries

I am also having issues where there are failed moults and no moults which are casuing smaller shrimp to bend and basically explode out of there exoskeloten.

WP:

Temp: 23-24 (heater is set @ 22)

gH: 6 (Using Salty Shrimp Minerals as per directions with RO)

pH : 5.5-6 (ADA Malaya and Power Sand)

Ammonia Nitrate and Nitrite all @ 0pmm (Used 2 different test kits, same results.)

2 HOB filters (1 big 1 small), choke full of ADA Bio Rio, on each tank (with a 1/2 serve of Purigen in the Mignon 360 HOB's

Beni Balls (3 in each tank)

Got Beni Shrimp Active water, Azoo Bio stuff + Growth Enzyme

Feed bee pollen, Bee Speed, and a Amino -P as well as Kale, Fluval Shrimp and boiled spinnach.

So, I have increased my water change to 3L every 1-2 days, which is drip fed into the HOB so not to shock anyone. Mix of RO, dechloriated tap and RO with Salty (all in order to keep TDS @ ~ 160-180. I have seen 1-2 moults in the CBS mish tank over last couple days, but the CRS tank, I am having these failed moults.

I have read BeeMax and "minerals" are needed (based on other peoples experience, but what exactly should I be using mineral wise? Is salty shrimp not enough?

Im really not wanting any more deaths, its not the $$$ but more then fact that I want to get this under control and actually start moving forward and breeding shrimp, instead of creating the new Hunger Games squel...

[Wraithie]

Do you have a TDS meter or are you working off calculated values?

[b00f]

Do you have a TDS meter or are you working off calculated values?

I have a TDS pen.

180 goes to 160 with an RO water change, 18L of water fills the tank, 2L water change...

100% RO reads @ 0

Have also used 2 calibration solutions, and both are smack on

(Which is surprising for a cheap TDS pen)

I have heard of people adding blackwater mineral from Salty shrimp, amougst other thigns with sucess...

I have tried a couple different "breeding" drops, which seemed to help the CBS mischlings "dance"... but the CRS hasnt seemed to have any effects...

[shrimpstan]

I'd say, for a start, give the tap water a miss. Even if it is dc tap water u don't know what else comes in tap water and it will distort your TDS readings. Your 160-180 TDS has an element of unknown substances in the water, some of which are more than likely toxic at certain levels. The number is not as important as the water quality. I have three TDS pens which all read 0 after RO but after 10ppm they are all different at 150 one of my pens reads 200, whilst the other will be about 180. So they are not the 'holy gospel' so to speak. See what happens when u do a 4-5L change with RO/SS @ 120 TDS?

For minerals only use the salty shrimp for RO when WC and beni 'mironecton powder' for adding into tank once a week or so. Don't do too many things at once because that can also be problematic and u may not realise what the problem was for the future. I once had this 'bendy' problem once when I was adding minerals that weren't needed. I stopped using that product and havn't seen the problem since.

Hope this helps!!

Goodluck!

[b00f]

I'd say' date=' for a start, give the tap water a miss. Even if it is dc tap water u don't know what else comes in tap water and it will distort your TDS readings. Your 160-180 TDS has an element of unknown substances in the water, some of which are more than likely toxic at certain levels. The number is not as important as the water quality. I have three TDS pens which all read 0 after RO but after 10ppm they are all different at 150 one of my pens reads 200, whilst the other will be about 180. So they are not the 'holy gospel' so to speak. See what happens when u do a 4-5L change with RO/SS @ 120 TDS?

For minerals only use the salty shrimp for RO when WC and beni 'mironecton powder' for adding into tank once a week or so. Don't do too many things at once because that can also be problematic and u may not realise what the problem was for the future. I once had this 'bendy' problem once when I was adding minerals that weren't needed. I stopped using that product and havn't seen the problem since.

Hope this helps!!

Goodluck![/quote']

THANKS!

My tap water has a TDS of 40 :P and thats tested with a proper probe (not a cheap pen)

I used the tap water purely to switch it up... water is aged, with heavy metal remover and airated for 48hours before adding always... worked on with some one my previous fish breeding.. so testing a theory with the shrimp

Im trying to take it slow, but when im having 1-4 deaths a week, its getting rather disheartening :(

[shrimpstan]

So sad to hear your loosing shrimp weekly!! :(

My tap TDS is 60.. still never use it though. Unless u have your water tested in a lab there is no way of knowing what makes up the TDS even if it is only 40-60ppm. If your tank is TDS 180 and your tap water is 40 at what level of minerals are derived from SS or your tap? Very hard to tell. Your adding chems to remove heavy metals when RO/DI does the same job without the chems. I don't know what aerating does to eliminate the toxicity of chems and metals but if your loosing multiple shrimp weekly its just not worth the risk IMO.

Also remember your tank is quite small so the smallest amount of harmful substance may kill in a small tank that may not kill when going into a 2 or 3 ft tank 100+ltrs. Even then they can kill.

IMO water chemistry is hard enough to understand when u know what is in the water column.. damn near impossible with unknown quantities of unknown elements though.

Give RO with SS a go for a month or so and see if you notice a positive change. :encouragement:

And also try beni mironecton powder if u don't already use it.

These are just my points of view that I share with you.

Hope all goes well for you and your shrimpies :)

[BlueBolts]

+1, nice reply shrimpstan. Tap water will always have an unknown element, plus an inconsistent one too..... I decided to use RO water 3+ years ago, simply because I wanted to know the reason why my shrimps died...etc. Using an unknown source doesn't give you that luxury. Over time, it teaches and directs you to understanding what the shrimps truly needs etc....as we all know, unknown deaths/reasons are extremely frustrating, and can dampen the love of the hobby.

[b00f]

Thanks for all the kind wise words...

I will continue with the RO and SS as directed and I'm getting all the tests I can get done at the LFS and see if the rocks are having any effect as well.

I use of tap water was in hope I might of been stripping something they are missing via RO/DI. I would consider less than 2L of tap water being introduced over the last month.. If that.

I can certainly now appreciate the technicalities if what you are saying and all the advice I'm getting is keeping me motivated :)

I shall take your advice and see how I go.. Hopefully things will look up.

Question. When water changing during this time would you suggest dripping the change in over the course of the whole day vs dumping the temperature matched water in over small amounts..

If I have such a small water column would this help with huge fluctuations??

Or am I just being paranoid.

[shrimpstan]

No, I'd say ur on the right track.. slower is better. Imagine a light shower in nature.. as opposed to a torrential down pour. For 2-3 ltrs maybe not all day but hey whats the rush right? But generally I've found that in this warmer weather my RO is about the same as tank temp as my room temp is now 23-24 degrees.

Do the vinegar test on the rocks.. scratch a few portions back and front.. if they sizzle they buffer.. if not all good :)

[b00f]

No' date=' I'd say ur on the right track.. slower is better. Imagine a light shower in nature.. as opposed to a torrential down pour. For 2-3 ltrs maybe not all day but hey whats the rush right? But generally I've found that in this warmer weather my RO is about the same as tank temp as my room temp is now 23-24 degrees.

Do the vinegar test on the rocks.. scratch a few portions back and front.. if they sizzle they buffer.. if not all good :)[/quote']

thanks!

Il continue with it on drip.. By all day, I mean until the 2-3L bottle im dipping from is empty, usually 5-6 hours

As for the rocks, I have done that, also soaked in RO water for 24 hours, and had my RO, tank and the "rock" water tested at LFS for EVERYTHING!

Everything was perfect. The guy was really nice "you are the first person to come in here with literally perfect water."

He used his RO probe (They do lots o big automated marine tanks and stuff) and also made sure my pen was calibrated properly. (Its fairly new so I didnt think it would be a problem)

I have not had any losses (touch wood) over the last 2 days, even though yesterday the tanks did hit about 26 due to temps in Melbourne)

Going to get some Genchem Beta-G as from what I am reading on almost every overseas forum/site, it has resolved almost everyone's mysterious shrimp deaths..

I have a smile on my face, gonna keep staying positive and hopefully get some results :)