All i have is a sword plant, needle leaf java and bolbitus. I havent ever really known what i was doing when dosing ferts such as flourish so would under dose then that stated on the bottle.

I want to get some Vallisneria americana which says it needs ferts and stuff according to one site. Now i have seachem excel and flourish would these be sufficient for plants like Vallisneria americana and if so how much would i need to dose with excel and flourish without harming my shrimp and helping with my plant growth ?

Seachem flourish is only a micro nutrient fertiliser. It only supplies micro elements, trace elements and other nutrients. These include calcium, magnesium, iron and other important elements. As you are starting out with plants, it's not going to be the fertiliser that will be lacking.

Macro nutrients like Nitrogen (N), Potassium (P) and Phosphorus (K) is what your aquatic plants will need most.

Seachem Excel or Glutaraldehyde (or Glut for short) is your alternative to CO2.

Once you supply CO2 or Glut, your plants will grow quicker along with high light, this is when the plants will draw up whatever NPK is in your tank and soon exhaust it's supply if you don't supplement it with additional fertiliser.

Personally, I would just add your plants without these ferts yet. Observe the plants growth and then introduce ferts if necessary.

Nitrogen (N) and Phosphorus(K) will occur naturally in your tank - Shrimp waste, food, etc are sources of such things. Only Potassium (P) will be lacking. Watch for Macro nutrient deficiencies then add as necessary.

Not adding ferts might mean that plants won't grow as fast. But then the plus is that you have less trimming and plant maintenance.

On another personal note, I won't add Excel or Glut into my shrimp tanks. Fish tank yes, but not delicate shrimps.

Glut is from the Aldehyde after all - it's a disinfectant, and it's the stuff they use in jars to preserve specimens. You know, the stuff you see in museums held in jars with liquid. Some people have used glut or excel with no effects, but I don't want to risk it.

Flourish and micro nutrients aren't as essential until you sort out NPK.

But again, I would try the plants out without ferts yet. Watch for plants exhibiting micro nutrient deficiencies then add as necessary.

My shrimp tank is heavily planted relative to the size of the tank, and plants are all doing well. I don't add any fertiliser apart from Calcium, magnesium, and shrimp food.

Get the balance with lighting correct and you will find ferts are not going to be the critical ingredient.

Informative writeup Jayc!

Just as an addition, i have been adding Excel to one of my tanks in an effort to control algae (the tank already has CO2). It doesnt seem to affect the Red Cherries but dont add it close to your moss! I have a very sad brown patch in the middle of my fissidens tree.

what should i look for to identify micro nutrient deficiency ? My plants sort of remain the same or little growth then a leaf or two will die off

Nutrient deficiencies

[TABLE=class: grid, width: 500]

Fertiliser

Area of deficiency

Symptom

Nitrogen

Old leaves

Leaves turn yellowish

Older leaves die off quickly in extreme deficiencies.

Iron

New leaves

Leaves grow in pale or yellow

Greenish nerves enclosing yellow leaf tissue

First seen in fast growing plants

Potassium

Old leaves

Pinholes appear in older leaves, and slowly

enlarge

Yellow areas

Withering of leaf edges and tips

Calcium

New leaves

Distorted leaf growth

cupped leaves

twisted and bent leaves

twisted and short roots

Damage and die off of growing points

Yellowish leaf edges

Extreme Calcium deficiency could result in a

plant where new leaves grow almost completely

white.

Magnesium

Old leaves

Yellow spots

Often appears similar to iron deficiency since mg deficiency prevents a plant from

properly using iron.

Yellowing of old leaves starting from edges while

major veins remain green

Boron

New leaves

Dead shoot tips, new side shoots also die

Brittle stems

Similar to calcium

Sulphur

New leaves

Similar to nitrogen deficiency

Manganese

New leaves

Dead yellowish tissue between leaf nerves

Copper

New leaves

Dead leaf tips and withered edges

Zinc

Old leaves

Yellowish areas between nerves,

Starting at leaf tip and edges

Molybdenum

Old leaves

Yellow spots between leaf nerves,

then brownish areas along edges.

Inhibited flowering

Phosphorus

Old leaves

Stunted growth.

Sometimes leaves become darker green

Also symptoms can be similar to nitrogen deficiency

[/TABLE]

hmmm think i am lacking a couple of things lol

you can sort of see the browning of some leafs in the needle leaf at centre back and the holes in the java fern on right

Your fern looks a little yellow, though my experiences with Java fern is that when the leaves get old they will die off in the way you describe.

wont stress too much then lol. The only plant i have had that ihave seen growth from is the bolbitus which 2ofus gave me and the needle leaf on the volcanic rockat the front was really small.

I have 3 skulls i going to put in the tank and i want some low light plants i can stick in the eyes lol

that's a handy table there jayc, I think I'll print it off and leave it near my tank!

I think you should do another thread with that table jayc & make it a sticky! Definitely a very handy table to have access to! :encouragement:

Will do.

Great post and very informative...thanks for the info