What is Biofilm?

[fishmosy]

The answer to both your questions is likely yes. Biofilms begin to form immediately once a surface becomes submerged in water. When a tank is set up, there are lots of nutrients released (from the substrate, from plants and mosses that are stressed due to being moved, ect.) so the biofilm can use these nutrients to grow well. At 4-6 weeks your tank would be cycled, so safe for shrimp, but still have a good layer of biofilm because of those nutrients during the first few weeks when the aquarium was cycling. 

The best way to answer the second question is: Imagine biofilm is like grass and your shrimp are like cows. If you have lots of cows in a paddock, the grass is eaten away. If you have few cows in a large paddock, then the grass gets a chance to regrow before it is grazed again. 

It is the same with shrimp. Shrimp are grazers and will reduce the amount of biofilm that is available through heavy grazing pressure. 

[Shrimpmaster]

[ShrimpFan]

Adding more surface area and thus effectively add more space for biofilm to colonize?

[Shrimpmaster]

It's a test. The plates are about 2mm from each other, so only shrimplets can feed on the biofilm that grows on them. 

[fishmosy]

Nice, should work, but I would recommend trying to get the biofilm growing on the plates outside of the tank. For example, in a tank on a windowsill with some old tank water to provide fertiliser.

I've moved away from using these plates for shrimp, instead using moss which comparatively has a much higher surface area. However I'm still using them for surface grazing species, specifically nerite snails.  

[Richcj]

What a brilliant thread, some cracking information,  given me a lot of food for thought. 

[Shrimpmaster]

Ok, this is funny. The thing above I build, it works, biofilm grows on it. Despite that, shrimp did not feed on it much. So it's kinda ugly and I decided to get it out of the tank. Guess what, when taking it out, about 10 to 15 small shrimplets came out. A few days old. So they must like this hiding/feeding place. So I put it back again :).

[Foxpuppet]

Just read through and realised I had a bunch of subwassertang growing in a tub that's covered in biofilm.... Dropped a bit into one of my breeder boxes and they swarmed it within minutes!

[Kaylenna]

On 10/30/2015 at 1:01 PM, fishmosy said:

I've moved away from using these plates for shrimp, instead using moss which comparatively has a much higher surface area.

 

How much moss do you tend to have in the shrimp tanks?  (any pics? Sorry if they're out there and I haven't seen them - I'm new to the forum and I'm sloooowly making my way through various threads.)  (What kind of surface area are we talking about?  Is there such a thing as TOO much?)

I have a lot of mosses etc in my tanks because I tend to prefer more "natural" environments (including things like plenty of biofilm as a food source) for my critters and because I love plants, but the trend among shrimp people seems to lean towards relatively bare tanks.  I was starting to wonder what I was missing, other than possibly being able to SEE all the shrimp all the time.  I'll admit that on a good day, I can probably find about 20% of my shrimp at any one time (I know the others are around because the ones I see rotate and because they all come scurrying out when I disturb bits to clean or in one of my rearranging fits). 

[ineke]

I don't think there is a hard and fast rule on how much moss you need. The bare tanks are more show type tanks . for breeding you want a bit more moss for hiding places for the newly moulted females and also for the babies to graze and hide. I love the bare tank look but my tanks are not like that. I have quite a lot of moss and plants in all my tanks and have very high survival rates for my babies. I do believe you should have a reasonable amount of substrate visible for the shrimp to turn over as there is also biofilm on that. I will show a few of my tanks but this is how I like to keep mine not necessarily the optimum way. I have started to use the ledges from @Newbreed Aquatics to have more use of the higher level of the tanks and leaving the bottom less cluttered I find them great as they are nearer the light and grow really well

 

 

Edited June 18, 2021 by ineke

[Kaylenna]

Lol.  Thank you Ineke.  I think I have about 1/2 the amount of visible substrate that you do... but some of the "covered" stuff has crevices underneath that I know the shrimp love.  Um... I've also got lots more ABOVE the substrate - moss "trees" and ropes (which are not actually anchored to the bottom at all).

[fishmosy]

9 hours ago, Kaylenna said:

 

How much moss do you tend to have in the shrimp tanks?  (any pics? Sorry if they're out there and I haven't seen them - I'm new to the forum and I'm sloooowly making my way through various threads.)  (What kind of surface area are we talking about?  Is there such a thing as TOO much?)

I have a lot of mosses etc in my tanks because I tend to prefer more "natural" environments (including things like plenty of biofilm as a food source) for my critters and because I love plants, but the trend among shrimp people seems to lean towards relatively bare tanks.  I was starting to wonder what I was missing, other than possibly being able to SEE all the shrimp all the time.  I'll admit that on a good day, I can probably find about 20% of my shrimp at any one time (I know the others are around because the ones I see rotate and because they all come scurrying out when I disturb bits to clean or in one of my rearranging fits). 

Depends on how many shrimp I have in there. One tank has at least half the volume of the tank filled with moss, and incidentally has the best survival rates of juveniles and consequently produces the most number of shrimp. However I rotate this moss into and out of the tank on a biweekly to monthly basis. The moss is a mix of native and exotic species - I can't be certain this matters, BUT logically different shaped mosses should promote the growth of different biofilm communities. 

[Kaylenna]

 

38 minutes ago, fishmosy said:

 One tank has at least half the volume of the tank filled with moss, and incidentally has the best survival rates of juveniles and consequently produces the most number of shrimp. However I rotate this moss into and out of the tank on a biweekly to monthly basis. The moss is a mix of native and exotic species - I can't be certain this matters, BUT logically different shaped mosses should promote the growth of different biofilm communities. 

Ha! wonderful.  Time to figure out where else I can stuff more plants.  My shrimp-only tank has about 12 species of plants, mostly mosses (I can't resist trying to grow new plants).  The some of mobile portions are occasionally swapped to the other tank I have at the moment (much much lower shrimp density and higher light), although I admit that's mostly because I like to fiddle and only recently because I found this biofilm thread!

This is the little 38L shrimp only tank.  It's a fairly new tank, so things still have to grow in, including the moss wall which will cover about 3/4 of the back of the tank (the whiteish part with trailing bits of green should end up solid green in about 2 or 3 more months).  I tried to clean up a bit before taking the picture... sorry about the glare and photo quality.

There really are shrimp, I promise!  I lured some out.

[zn30]

Great topic explains a lot, and some good ideas. 

One thing to ponder after reading the Wiki link, dental plaque is a biofilm ........ mmmm don't think I will be placing shrimp in my mouth!

[revolutionhope]

Great topic explains a lot, and some good ideas. 

One thing to ponder after reading the Wiki link, dental plaque is a biofilm ........ mmmm don't think I will be placing shrimp in my mouth!

But at least we know that if we have kids then they can place their teeth in the shrimp tank for the toothshrimp to clean up!

Sent from my SM-N920I using Tapatalk

[MonsterNelson]

On 10/13/2015 at 9:43 AM, fishmosy said:

The answer to both your questions is likely yes. Biofilms begin to form immediately once a surface becomes submerged in water. When a tank is set up, there are lots of nutrients released (from the substrate, from plants and mosses that are stressed due to being moved, ect.) so the biofilm can use these nutrients to grow well. At 4-6 weeks your tank would be cycled, so safe for shrimp, but still have a good layer of biofilm because of those nutrients during the first few weeks when the aquarium was cycling. 

The best way to answer the second question is: Imagine biofilm is like grass and your shrimp are like cows. If you have lots of cows in a paddock, the grass is eaten away. If you have few cows in a large paddock, then the grass gets a chance to regrow before it is grazed again. 

It is the same with shrimp. Shrimp are grazers and will reduce the amount of biofilm that is available through heavy grazing pressure. 

Sometimes I get lazy on cleaning thermometers, suction caps and other submerged equipment from my fish tanks so I'd let my shrimps do the cleaning for me! I love my cows.

[pseudechisbutleri]

How long do I need to leave the tank to grow the biofilm, before I can add the shrimp?

[fishmosy]

3 hours ago, pseudechisbutleri said:

How long do I need to leave the tank to grow the biofilm, before I can add the shrimp?

There are no hard and fast rules for this because each tank is different - just like every biofilm is different due to differences in the organisms that make it up.

there are, however, some things you can do to boost growth before adding shrimp. One easy thing you can do is to boost the daylength - as in run your lights for as long as you can, 12-18hrs works well. You can also dose fertilisers to boost algae growth, although this can sometimes promote the growth of hair algae rather than beneficial algae - e.g. greenspot and diatoms. Some shrimp will eat hair algae so it all depends on which shrimp you plant to keep. Regardless, I f adding fertiliser, you will need to do large water changes before adding shrimp to get water parameters to where they need to be, (e.g. Very low nitrates). The final thing you can do is to give the tank plenty of time to mature. On occasion I have let tanks sit without shrimps for 3 or 4 months to mature and develop a nice coating of biofilm. 

[pseudechisbutleri]

6 minutes ago, fishmosy said:

There are no hard and fast rules for this because each tank is different - just like every biofilm is different due to differences in the organisms that make it up.

there are, however, some things you can do to boost growth before adding shrimp. One easy thing you can do is to boost the daylength - as in run your lights for as long as you can, 12-18hrs works well. You can also dose fertilisers to boost algae growth, although this can sometimes promote the growth of hair algae rather than beneficial algae - e.g. greenspot and diatoms. Some shrimp will eat hair algae so it all depends on which shrimp you plant to keep. Regardless, I f adding fertiliser, you will need to do large water changes before adding shrimp to get water parameters to where they need to be, (e.g. Very low nitrates). The final thing you can do is to give the tank plenty of time to mature. On occasion I have let tanks sit without shrimps for 3 or 4 months to mature and develop a nice coating of biofilm. 

Cool, thanks

[Kaylenna]

Soo... I've got a pump that I've attached tubing to in order to split the output (2 section tank + 2 breeder boxes).  The tubing very quickly develops some nice brown gunk...  Is it biofilm?  Should I dump it into the tanks or is it better not to? 

(I call it my hexapus because it's got 6 outlets, as in "Ahhh the hexapus ate my tubing!")

[jayc]

12 minutes ago, Kaylenna said:

nice brown gunk...  Is it biofilm?

You could call that biofilm, yes.

[Kaylenna]

3 minutes ago, jayc said:

You could call that biofilm, yes.

You sound dubious... lol.  Should I dump it into the tank or remove it?

 

[jayc]

9 hours ago, Kaylenna said:

dubious

It's difficult to tell from just a picture.

it should be safe to dump it back into the tank. It's already part of the tank system.

[Grubs]

There are better sources of biofilm.  I've noticed that there is a particular slime that grows on silicon air lines when they are new that is thick and slimy and often gets a pink colour to it like your photo ^. It seems to me that the cheaper the air line, the thicker the sludge.  I assume there is something leaching from the hose wall that is fuelling a bacterial feeding frenzy.   I normally wipe it off with a tissue and after a couple of weeks and it stops coming back.  This stuff I wouldn't feed to shrimp.

I do feed them the algae (biofilm) that grows on the underside of my glass covers under the lights by scraping the glass with a credit card and washing in the tank.  It cleans the glass and feeds the shrimp - win win.

Edited August 30, 2016 by Grubs

[ageofaquariums]

A trick we use to cull snails is to leave a fish net in a bucket of aquarium water. Outside if possible. Few days later the net will have a nice biofilm on it. If the net is then added to an aquarium, snails will swarm all over it. Net can then be removed, the snails shaken off and the process repeated.

Perhaps netting would be a good medium for growing shrimp biofilm food?