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Disciple

Water Changes for New Tank question

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Disciple

Thanks in advance.

 

I am into my 3rd week of cycling my new tank. It seems like I am into my 3rd stage of the nitrogen cycle.

 

My ammonia is at .05 but my nitrates are at the 100ppm range which seems very high. My ph is 6.6.

 

Not sure if I should stick with a 20% water change or go with a 50% water change?

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Sprae

Got any fish or shrimps in there? If not, go 50% WC. 

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Disciple

Got any fish or shrimps in there? If not, go 50% WC. 

 

I have one neon in there.

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shrimpstan

Hey mate, U should be ok if u do a 50% WC. If u want to be cautious drip the first 25% over a couple hrs depending on temp difference  (between new water and tank temp) and amount added. The final 25% can go in a bit quicker as it will be going into a larger body of water and therefore will have slightly less effect than the first 25%. That's how I change my water, works well. Hopefully will work well for u too :thumbsu:

 

Good luck

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Disciple

Hey mate, U should be ok if u do a 50% WC. If u want to be cautious drip the first 25% over a couple hrs depending on temp difference  (between new water and tank temp) and amount added. The final 25% can go in a bit quicker as it will be going into a larger body of water and therefore will have slightly less effect than the first 25%. That's how I change my water, works well. Hopefully will work well for u too :thumbsu:

 

Good luck

 

Thanks Shrimpstan & Sprae,

 

Did a few test in the morning

 

Before water change

 

i had 6.6ph almost yellow (.05ppm) ammonia and about 50ppm nitrates

 

checked the water going in and it was about 7.2 ph

 

An hour after the water change

 

I have 6.8ph 0 ammonia and between 25ppm - 50ppm nitrates. I hope to keep it stable at these water parameters.

 

How long should I wait before I introduce shrimp into the tank?

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jayc

Not until Ammonia read 0 without any doubt.

Nitrates still a bit high for my liking, another water change to bring it down would be good.

 

Are you using tap water + water conditioner?

If you are, the chloramines in the tap water is contributing to the ammonia and hence the nitrates as the bacteria break down the ammonia.

 

I'd wait another week before adding any shrimp.

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Disciple

Not until Ammonia read 0 without any doubt.

Nitrates still a bit high for my liking, another water change to bring it down would be good.

 

Are you using tap water + water conditioner?

If you are, the chloramines in the tap water is contributing to the ammonia and hence the nitrates as the bacteria break down the ammonia.

 

I'd wait another week before adding any shrimp.

 

Yea I am using tap water and water conditioner. I aim to get a ro unit as soon as I can.

 

Do you think I should be doing another 50% water change in a few days? What should I be aiming to get for my Nitrates?

 

Thanks.

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inverted

Yea I am using tap water and water conditioner. I aim to get a ro unit as soon as I can.

 

Do you think I should be doing another 50% water change in a few days? What should I be aiming to get for my Nitrates?

 

Thanks.

As low as possible.... You will hear a lot of opinions. You should aim to replace 50% of your water weekly 2 x 25% changes.

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jayc

What inverted said.

Multiple small water changes twice a week is better than one big water change once a week.

 

Multiple small water changes is better than one massive 50% change.

Less stressful when you have shrimp in the tank. And the beneficial bacteria can deal with smaller amounts of the chloramine quicker. Less of a spike in Nitrates.

 

When your tank is finally cycled, and when you have shrimp in the tank ... you can cut down to 5-10% twice weekly.

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Disciple

What inverted said.

Multiple small water changes twice a week is better than one big water change once a week.

 

Multiple small water changes is better than one massive 50% change.

Less stressful when you have shrimp in the tank. And the beneficial bacteria can deal with smaller amounts of the chloramine quicker. Less of a spike in Nitrates.

 

When your tank is finally cycled, and when you have shrimp in the tank ... you can cut down to 5-10% twice weekly.

 

 

As low as possible.... You will hear a lot of opinions. You should aim to replace 50% of your water weekly 2 x 25% changes.

 

Thanks Guys

 

I will do a couple of 25% water changes every few days until ammonia is down to 0 constantly and the nitrates are lower. Would you say less than 20 ppm nitrates?

 

I also noticed that algae and snails are starting to appear. Should I do anything about that, I was thinking to leave it for the shrimp to eventual feast on.

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shrimpstan

Yeah mate aim for less than 20 ppm for nitrates. Once fully cycled u prob have 0-5ppm.

 

Honestly I've had shrimp in WP worse than u have now in a high fert high co2 planted which survive fine. Some are hard like bullets.. like red cherries, mishlings, lower grade crs/gbs and wilds. The reason why I say this is because sometimes for everything to zero out can take weeks.. so if u have any of these spare, throw some in as pioneer shrimp (sounds better than test subjects) :p

 

If u don't have any PM me and if ur happy to pay for postage I have around 15-20 shrimp im looking to move on anyways. No charge on shrimp.

 

Algae on tank is a sign of cycling.. normally goes from brownish to green as it matures. Your right leave it for the shrimp to graze. High Nitrates cause conditions for algae blooms. Keep lights to a minimum to avoid an absolute outbreak but your water changes will bring down your Nitrates and therefore slow down the growth however this can be circumstantial. When it goes stringy thats the worst IMO absolutely sucks!

 

 

Also if u have IAL add a leaf or 2 to your bucket of tap water with an airstone and give it a few days before adding it to your tank. This will also help you and your future shrimp ;)

 

Good luck

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Disciple

Yeah mate aim for less than 20 ppm for nitrates. Once fully cycled u prob have 0-5ppm.

 

Honestly I've had shrimp in WP worse than u have now in a high fert high co2 planted which survive fine. Some are hard like bullets.. like red cherries, mishlings, lower grade crs/gbs and wilds. The reason why I say this is because sometimes for everything to zero out can take weeks.. so if u have any of these spare, throw some in as pioneer shrimp (sounds better than test subjects) :p

 

If u don't have any PM me and if ur happy to pay for postage I have around 15-20 shrimp im looking to move on anyways. No charge on shrimp.

 

Algae on tank is a sign of cycling.. normally goes from brownish to green as it matures. Your right leave it for the shrimp to graze. High Nitrates cause conditions for algae blooms. Keep lights to a minimum to avoid an absolute outbreak but your water changes will bring down your Nitrates and therefore slow down the growth however this can be circumstantial. When it goes stringy thats the worst IMO absolutely sucks!

 

 

Also if u have IAL add a leaf or 2 to your bucket of tap water with an airstone and give it a few days before adding it to your tank. This will also help you and your future shrimp ;)

 

Good luck

Thanks Again.

 

Your offer is very generous.

 

I feel I should wait another week or two. I think the tank is almost finished Cycling. I would like to give the shrimp I first get the best chance of a good life as possible.

 

I think the main issue is thinking it was a good idea to try have a nice iwagumi styled aquarium with shrimp as my first aquarium : SURPRISE : . I should have just aimed for a perfect shrimp tank lol. The more I read and learn the more I realise it isnt going to be as easy as i thought but I am learning a lot from SKF.

 

Again, Thank you for your generous offer but I do not think I have earnt freebies from anyone. I would like to pay for your shrimp when my tank it ready.

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jayc

 

Again, Thank you for your generous offer but I do not think I have earnt freebies from anyone. I would like to pay for your shrimp when my tank it ready.

You soon learn that SKF is different to other online communities.

I have said it once, this place feels like "Shrimp Keepers Family" rather than Forum.

You don't need to have earned freebies. People are just generous here.

Just do the same for others when you have the chance.

@shrimpstan, way to go with spreading the SKF generosity and spirit.

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shrimpstan

Thanks Again.

 

Your offer is very generous.

Again, Thank you for your generous offer but I do not think I have earnt freebies from anyone. I would like to pay for your shrimp when my tank it ready.

 

 

You soon learn that SKF is different to other online communities.

I have said it once, this place feels like "Shrimp Keepers Family" rather than Forum.

You don't need to have earned freebies. People are just generous here.

Just do the same for others when you have the chance.

@shrimpstan, way to go with spreading the SKF generosity and spirit.

 

@jayc.. such a SKF nube huh? ;)

 

@Disciple.. Haha dont be silly, like Jayc said there is nothing to earn here to get a helping hand. I will basically guarantee that once u do a another 2x50% WC in a similar fashion to your last WC over this coming week by next week you could literally throw these shrimp in and 90% will probably survive as your WP will be quite close.. and these shrimp are tough and will grind it out and start to help mature your tank. You will give them a little food, they will do little poops and with WC's your tank will start to become a home. Wait a month or so then start to look at more beautiful shrimp, there are endless options especially these days. But by doing this you really limit losses and you will gain experience. When it comes to feeding, especially powdered foods, less is more. Everyone here will tell you that the first 2-3 months are the most fragile and it can be heart breaking when all seems good but starts going south for no apparent reason. This can be avoided by starting slow.

 

Your right an iwagumi may prove a little challenging first up, depending on previous experience. Personally my shrimp tank are strictly shrimp tanks and they serve the purpose to cater for shrimps needs primarily with low maintenance greens like subwassertang and mosses. Not to say i dont have other plants with them but generally co2, HC and shrimp eventually dont work well together. But i say this because for me I look for survival rate of shrimplets, something co2 usage will somewhat limit depending on amount used. Ive done both.. definitely no co2 is better for shrimplet survival, whilst high demanding plants like HC will suffer and cause other problems. This is just my experience im sure some guys here have had better luck than me. If your goal is iwagumi with a few shrimps and your not looking at them multiplying into a massive colony, and your going more for the aesthetic appearance of the tank then go for it if your up to the challenge :thumbsu:

 

As for the shrimp I cant stress it too much that I'm happy to send them.. no pressure :sword: 

 

LOL!

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OzShrimp

Are you dosing anything like seachem stability after your do your water changes or daily as your cycling your tank?

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Disciple

Are you dosing anything like seachem stability after your do your water changes or daily as your cycling your tank?

 

I am just using tap water and I am using API Tap water conditioner. I am pretty much totally new at this.

 

I thought I had it covered but I keep finish out new things to learn :S.

 

I do not know about seachem at all.. 

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Disciple

You soon learn that SKF is different to other online communities.

I have said it once, this place feels like "Shrimp Keepers Family" rather than Forum.

You don't need to have earned freebies. People are just generous here.

Just do the same for others when you have the chance.

@shrimpstan, way to go with spreading the SKF generosity and spirit.

Yeah it has been quite rewarding just going through all the posts.

 

I am very happy that I joined SKF.

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OzShrimp

I am just using tap water and I am using API Tap water conditioner. I am pretty much totally new at this.

 

I thought I had it covered but I keep finish out new things to learn :S.

 

I do not know about seachem at all.. 

There are a few products you can buy such as seachem stability which is beneficial bacteria in a bottle, you dose as per instructions on the bottle and it helps to establish the basteria colony in your tank, There are other products like Start smart complete which claims to cycle your tank in 24hrs but i am not convinced by that.

 

With stability they recommend to also dose some when you do water changes aswell. Seachem also have a program called prime which is a water conditioner, i have used API myself and personally just prefer the seachem range but dont have anything to say they dont do the exact same thing.

 

Would definitely recommend getting stability though 

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Disciple

@jayc.. such a SKF nube huh? ;)

 

@Disciple.. Haha dont be silly, like Jayc said there is nothing to earn here to get a helping hand. I will basically guarantee that once u do a another 2x50% WC in a similar fashion to your last WC over this coming week by next week you could literally throw these shrimp in and 90% will probably survive as your WP will be quite close.. and these shrimp are tough and will grind it out and start to help mature your tank. You will give them a little food, they will do little poops and with WC's your tank will start to become a home. Wait a month or so then start to look at more beautiful shrimp, there are endless options especially these days. But by doing this you really limit losses and you will gain experience. When it comes to feeding, especially powdered foods, less is more. Everyone here will tell you that the first 2-3 months are the most fragile and it can be heart breaking when all seems good but starts going south for no apparent reason. This can be avoided by starting slow.

 

Your right an iwagumi may prove a little challenging first up, depending on previous experience. Personally my shrimp tank are strictly shrimp tanks and they serve the purpose to cater for shrimps needs primarily with low maintenance greens like subwassertang and mosses. Not to say i dont have other plants with them but generally co2, HC and shrimp eventually dont work well together. But i say this because for me I look for survival rate of shrimplets, something co2 usage will somewhat limit depending on amount used. Ive done both.. definitely no co2 is better for shrimplet survival, whilst high demanding plants like HC will suffer and cause other problems. This is just my experience im sure some guys here have had better luck than me. If your goal is iwagumi with a few shrimps and your not looking at them multiplying into a massive colony, and your going more for the aesthetic appearance of the tank then go for it if your up to the challenge :thumbsu:

 

As for the shrimp I cant stress it too much that I'm happy to send them.. no pressure :sword:

 

LOL!

 

I will put my ambitions of a Iwagumi scape aside and focus 100% on a shrimp tank for sure (i guess i need an excuse for another tank in the near future).

 

Well it would be rude of me not to take up your generous offer. I have sent a pm. Thanks again. I hope I will be able to repay in the future.

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OzShrimp
Stability
Product Description

Stability® will rapidly and safely establish the aquarium biofilter in freshwater and marine systems, thereby preventing the #1 cause of fish death: "new tank syndrome". Stability® is formulated specifically for the aquarium and contains a synergistic blend of aerobic, anaerobic, and facultative bacteria which facilitate the breakdown of waste organics, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. Unlike competing products, the bacteria employed by Stability® are non-sulfur fixing and will not produce toxic hydrogen sulfide. Stability® is completely harmless to all aquatic organisms as well as aquatic plants, thus there is no danger of over use. Stability® is the culmination of nearly a decade of research and development and represents the current state of the art in natural biological management.

Sizes: 50 mL, 100 mL, 250 mL, 500 mL, 2 L, 4 L, 20 L

Why It's Different

Illustration of Stability'sâ„¢ bacteria on biofiltration material.stability contains a synergistic blend of aerobic, anaerobic, and facultative bacteria

The bacteria used in competing products are inherently unstable. The conditions necessary for their growth and development fall into a very narrow range of temperatures, pH, organic loads, etc. When any of these parameters are not strictly within the proper range, the bacterial culture quickly crashes and dies. Stability® does not contain any of the aforementioned bacteria.

The bacteria strains in Stability® have been in development for over a decade. The necessary conditions for growth of our bacterial strains encompass a very broad range. When other bacteria begin to die off (usually from high organic loads caused by the undetected death of an organism), Stability® simply works harder and grows faster! The strains function in fresh or saltwater. Stability® contains both nitrifying and denitrifying bacteria, a blend found in no other product. Additionally, Stability® contains facultative bacterial strains which are able to adapt to either aerobic or anaerobic conditions. The bacteria in Stability® are non-sulfur fixing, another innovation in the industry. Most other bacterial supplements will form toxic hydrogen sulfide under the proper conditions. Stability® will not, ever.

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Disciple

There are a few products you can buy such as seachem stability which is beneficial bacteria in a bottle, you dose as per instructions on the bottle and it helps to establish the basteria colony in your tank, There are other products like Start smart complete which claims to cycle your tank in 24hrs but i am not convinced by that.

 

With stability they recommend to also dose some when you do water changes aswell. Seachem also have a program called prime which is a water conditioner, i have used API myself and personally just prefer the seachem range but dont have anything to say they dont do the exact same thing.

 

Would definitely recommend getting stability though 

Thanks Ozshrimp,

 

I will try pop down to Aquotix today and grab some.

 

I have been doing some reading about RO water and saltyshrimp minerals. On top of that I started looking into Oxydators and Benibachi mineral balls. Can you shed some light into these products? it is something advanced shrimp use or is it something they would be good for beginners to try?

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OzShrimp

RO Water is great to get into as soon as you can basically it strips all the bad stuff out of it then the salty shrimp is just remineraliation and allows you to get the water to the preferred perimeters :) 

 

The mineral balls are that they release minerals which are beneficial for the health and well being of your shrimp whilst absorbing substances out of the water. heres a couple of things that you can look at for a bit more detail about the products, pretty much majority of our sponsors sell alot of good stuff so check them out and have a read. Majority are more for lie CRS and what not.

 

 

If you want a great RO unit i would recommend Filter systems australia they do great aquarium RO units and have sponsored the forum in a couple of competitions.

 

Can read about minerals here

http://www.bossaquaria.com.au/bee-shrimp-mineral-gh-230g/

 

 

Balls 

http://www.bossaquaria.com.au/mk-breed-life-ball/

 

The oxydators from memory are used to oxygenate the water i dont have one of these so cant really comment much. 

 

 

Theres plenty of shrimp stuff you can read the descriptions about on the sponsors sites

 

Boss Aquaria

http://www.bossaquaria.com.au/shrimp-care/?sort=featured&page=1

 

The Tech Den

http://www.thetechden.com.au/Shrimp_Products_s/1893.htm

 

Age of Aquariums amongst the others :) The first two have designated shrimp areas :) 

Edited by OzShrimp

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jayc

If you need to use bacteria additive, THE best product I have used, and I've used many, is without doubt 'Prodibio Biodigest'.

These come in sealed glass vials. 

 

Completely clean new tank and new filter media was cycled in 24-36 hours.

Ammonia went from 2.0 to nothing.

 

All other products I've used still took weeks to cycle. Putting doubt in my mind as to whether the tank cycled normally, and if the product even worked.

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shrimpstan

+ one for seachem stability.

 

For a shrimp tank I now learn towards shrimp specialty products like Mosura BT9. Maybe thats why it takes so long :p

 

If you need to use bacteria additive, THE best product I have used, and I've used many, is without doubt 'Prodibio Biodigest'.

These come in sealed glass vials. 

 

Completely clean new tank and new filter media was cycled in 24-36 hours.

Ammonia went from 2.0 to nothing.

 

All other products I've used still took weeks to cycle. Putting doubt in my mind as to whether the tank cycled normally, and if the product even worked.

 

Yo jayc where u find this stuff? sounds like a magical fantasy land : AWE :

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jayc

+ one for seachem stability.

 

For a shrimp tank I now learn towards shrimp specialty products like Mosura BT9. Maybe thats why it takes so long :p

 

 

Yo jayc where u find this stuff? sounds like a magical fantasy land : AWE :

 

Except it actually works.

Alvin Chan (ala Aquarist Chamber) put me onto them. He uses it too.

 

You will have to google it to find it in Aust. Sold in Aus by the site that isn't an SKF sponsor.

I got mine overseas. 

 

I've learnt that BT-9 doesn't actually contain bacteria.

It just adds minerals and helps provide a better environment that might contribute to better conditions for bacterial colonisation.

It doesn't actually add bacteria.

 

But Prodibio is different. I'm convinced there are actually millions of bacteria in each vial. Which would explain the quick cycle time of a new tank.

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