Jump to content

Mischlings

BlueBolts

By BlueBolts
in Taiwan Bee Shrimp - Caridina mariae x logemanni

 Share

Recommended Posts

KiwiBigD Shrimp Breeder

KiwiBigD

Posted
Posted

Great write up Marcus, I think this was really needed on the forum, especially to highly the likes of TB vs TBM vs TBMM. The one thing I would say though as well, if you're breeding TBs and TBMs then please know which are which when it comes to selling. I've had a couple which I'd brought as TB however it appears with the young produced that they were TBM, quite fustrating and I paid a good price for them, so I would say know your dealer! The result from a cross as I found was far from what I expected and I've got 4 shrimp that although I'm keeping as they look good they're not TBs as they had siblings from the same drop that are Mischlings :-(

Link to comment
Share on other sites
BlueBolts Shrimp Guru

BlueBolts

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Totally 100% agree ! Especially from a selective program perspective, introducing a "false" TB (ie. TBM or TBMM), will set the program back, which is extremely frustrating. Totally appreciate the use of mishlings for newbies, and for a genetic/strength injection, but when selling, honesty is important !

Imagine having olony of PR's, with 2-3 years of selective breeding, and introducing a false PRL, and it throws out CBS, SW/GB's etc.... That'll be sooooo f&(9(!%#! frustrating.

The next phase/level is patterns, with TB's... i.e. SSS/SS grades etc.... Be great if someone has a selective program based on pure SSS/SS graded TB's, as I'm desperately searching for a WR & KK with these grades... :-)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
HexaD Shrimp Breeder

HexaD

Posted
Posted

Thanks for the info again BB, one thing I found since I ventured into TBs was that I always found myself referring back to the chart from Fabio Silva, which best explains the "theory" of TB's off-springs in this thread you posted a while back

http://www.shrimpkeepersforum.com/forum/showthread.php/1236-TB-Taiwan-Bee-Breeding-Program

Since this is a sticky, would it be okay to attach the chart to the first post? It really helped me in understanding TB/Misch/TBM/TBMM, and hope it can help others as well :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Squiggle Shrimp Guru

Squiggle

Posted
Posted
The next phase/level is patterns' date=' with TB's... i.e. SSS/SS grades etc.... Be great if someone has a selective program based on pure SSS/SS graded TB's, as I'm desperately searching for a WR & KK with these grades... :-)[/quote']

Completely agree. :victorious:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 5 months later...
  • 3 months later...
sez0607 Shrimp Enthusiast

sez0607

Posted
Posted

Great info - thanks. I'm just starting out with tbs and crossing with mischlings as am not confident in outlaying a large amount of money just in case it doesn't work out. I have separated my mischlings into 2 seperate tanks and have the opposite gender tb with them in order to avoid any production of tbmm :) although I only have male tbs ATM anyways. If I get some female tbm offspring then I will cross tb with tb obviously :)

Just have a question:

A pure tb x f5/6 mischling - the non tb offspring, are they classified a a mischling or just CBS/crs? I mean obviously they don't possess enough tb gene to be a tb but how can we know exactly how far they were away from beinga tb. This just confuses me as particularly when I need to sell them, should I just sell them as crs/CBS or a mischling?

Sorry if question is silly or has been answered numerous times :|

Thanks :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
newbreed Shrimp Guru

newbreed

Posted
Posted

Hey Sez, we don't believe in silly questions, as it can be confusing.

If you cross a TB with F6 Mischling, any TB looking bubs will be TBM, and the CRS/CBS looking ones would be F7 Mischling.

The F number increases with each generation crossed to a TB.

Does that make sense?

Congrats on getting into TBs, they are awesome! Keep us posted on the outcome!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
newbreed Shrimp Guru

newbreed

Posted
Posted

Offspring from F6xF6 -

 

If they look like KK, WR, Panda, BB or RR then they will be TBMM (Taiwan Bee from Mischling x Mischling).

 

If they look like CRS/CBS then they are classified as F1 Mischlings, back to the start. As neither parent was a direct TB, the TB gene has been reduced by this cross.

 

Hope I got that right?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
sez0607 Shrimp Enthusiast

sez0607

Posted
Posted

Ah excellent, thanks guys. I'm not sure why I asked the first question as I already knew that.. It was the latter question I meant to ask :|

I shall blame "baby brain" for that one :) haha

Link to comment
Share on other sites
newbreed Shrimp Guru

newbreed

Posted
Posted (edited)

Don't hesitate to ask any question. :D

 

It may sound like a simple question, but there may be other members who want to know the answer but are too shy to ask. Also, it may not have been asked before.

 

Every question raised helps us all out by making us think and reminding us of things we may overlook.

 

End of the day, there are no silly questions!!

 

Having baby brain means congrats are in order too!! :thumbsu: Hope you get some sleep soon!!

Edited by newbreed
Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 4 months later...
jc12 Shrimp Lover

jc12

Posted
Posted

This may be a silly question.

If the TB offsprings from TB x Mischling are call TBMs, and the TB offsprings from Mischling x Mischling are call TBMMs. what do you call theTB offsprings from TB x TBM or TB x TBMM? What about TB offsprings from TBM x TBM or TBMM x TBMM etc?

This is confusing. How would you ever know if a TB is pure or mixed with TBM/TBMM?

Sorry for my newbie question.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
newbreed Shrimp Guru

newbreed

Posted
Posted

Hi JC12.

 

I guess you would only ever know the true purity of TB by their offspring. The more diluted the TB gene is, the less TB type offspring you will get per drop, theoretically.

 

I only trust a TB to be pure based on the history of the seller.

 

I always ask for information on shrimps genetic history prior to purchase, but it depends what you are getting them for. If you just want to breed them and get a mixed bag of babies, it doesn't matter, but if you are on a particular breeding project it's best to know what genetics you are adding to the mix. IMHO.   :jig:

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
jc12 Shrimp Lover

jc12

Posted
Posted

Thanks Newbreed.

I am keen to breed TBs but find them difficult to source in QLD so I bought a Panda, KK and couple of mischlings (all juvies) from Sydney few weeks ago. They are currently with 15 CRSs which I just started about two months back in a 40L tank, and I just spotted my first two berried CRSs last weekend. Super excited. Hence my questions re: mischlings. I am trying to grow my colony. :-) I have another 90L and a 4x2x2 tank ready for them should their population miraculously grow exponentially. Fingers crossed. :-)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Join Our Community!

    Register today, ask questions and share your shrimp and fish tank experiences with us!

  • Must Read SKF Articles

    Shrimp Disease and Treatment
    Tibee, Taitbee, Pinto, Mischling, F1, F2

  • Tropical Fish Forum
    Discus Breeding Guide
    Discus Disease and Treatment Guide

  • Posts

    • herrwibi
      Tank Reset - What soil does everyone use?

      By herrwibi · Posted

      I've attached a small bit to the rock as the tank is currently cycling that had the crystal reds in it . I've always been torn between blue bolts and shadow pandas but blue bolts always wins. I never thought about taking some from my other tank and using them a tester but that is a good plan, saves me getting some blue bolts and then all of a sudden i have a big issue again. Hopefully not . That's why i am glad i have the bigger tank and also any of the lighter blue bolts can go into the bigger tank for culling. I've attached a few more favourite. My favourite shrimp which i think this is correct is an extreme bkk . I've also got a photo of one of my many red wines.  https://ibb.co/BVhDMMK https://ibb.co/42Q3ZYc https://ibb.co/gTD403T
    • sdlTBfanUK
      Tank Reset - What soil does everyone use?

      By sdlTBfanUK · Posted

      It may be worth holding off on the subwassertang as when you set up the new tank you can then use it in there? I think I could see a few red wine, if they aren't full size, could just have been the light though! There are 3 half size white shrimp with a red head between the large crs in the third photo of the sponge (about half way down), they are beautiful also .They may just be crs but the photo looks redder than those, but may again just be the light! My overall favourites are blue bolts also. I would use some of the crs though for about 3 months as a tester before getting blue bolts for the re-setup tank, you can then remove the crs. You have lots of the crs and you know they are healthy so it makes sense to use them (free) to 'test' that all is ok first, before getting the blue bolts! It will help mentally also, just think how devastated you would be if for some reason the blue bolts died because there is a problem (you won't know with them whether it was the shrimp or the setup), whereas you would still be upset with the crs dying but not as much - they were free and you have plenty of others in the other tank. If you want blue bolts only in the tank you may well get offspring of other colour/pattern depending on the genes of the parents, but then they can be moved to the other tank. ie Blue bolt mother and blue bolt father may create something not blue bolt, depending on the genes etc. 
    • herrwibi
      Tank Reset - What soil does everyone use?

      By herrwibi · Posted

      Thank you, i enjoy a simple scape although i really need to try and take both sections of subwassertang out for a trim. They have just gone mad.  Things are doing great in this tank, i love my red wines as well bit couldn't find any at the time of taking a photo.  There is but i'm not sure they would breed true, i suppose it could be a project for me to breed them true but wouldn't know where to start. My other project i was thinking is just blue bolts in that tank , i love the colour.  I also suffer from slow breeding in winter although i've never had so much success with my taiwans/mischling that i hope it continues. 
    • sdlTBfanUK
      Tank Reset - What soil does everyone use?

      By sdlTBfanUK · Posted

      That is a fabulous tank, is it built into a wall or partition. Love the simplicity of the layout, you can see lots of shrimp - I tend to overcrowd mine with plants so don't get to see so many shrimp. Great to hear that this tank is doing well and you have quite a few shrimp in there! Especially like the panda and blue bolt in the photos. As you have so many crs in this tank you shouldn't need to buy any more for your reset tank so that will be great and you know the shrimp are good quality and healthy, and that will make a bit of room in this tank for the next generation at the same time? You may experience the slowing down or stopping breeding for winter, though not everyone has that? Thanks for the photos!
    • herrwibi
      Tank Reset - What soil does everyone use?

      By herrwibi · Posted

      Hope these linke are OK.  Files are too big to upload through the website . https://ibb.co/n3NBkFr https://ibb.co/QKk4Bn0 https://ibb.co/GtpRhXf https://ibb.co/Xs0HKmH https://ibb.co/CtRX2X3
×
×
  • Create New...