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h20rat

Water...the wet stuff

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h20rat

Still newbing and stuff so I'm wondering. I've been drinking filtered water for a long time like charcoal filtered Brita etc. I figured if they stripped out any nasties for us, surely that can't be bad for the aquarium so I've always just run water thru an old jug and filter before a couple of drops of ager and into the tank. I used to do five litres a go and have sitting a couple of days before using.

Any problems with this?

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MrShrimp

I use RO/DI water for my shrimps. It's the cleanest and purest filter water I could use. I don't think you need to use water ager as the filter should remove the chlorine already but I could wrong.

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Squiggle

Should be ok, I would check your TDS(total dissolved solids) & see if it's not too high :victorious:

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ineke

I have a pura tap supposed to be top of the line filter, the water tastes great but the ph remains at 7.4 and TDS 130 technically good for cherries but I got the RO unit once I went to crystals. Also when the filter cartridge was first changed on the pura tap the TDS went up to 300 for a couple of weeks. I don't think the water filter jugs would be much different to the pura tap, ok for cherries but not necessarily for crystals. Having said that there are still people on the forum using straight unfiltered tap water with no problems I guess it just depends if you are willing to take the chance :encouragement:

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KiwiBigD

I'm one of those that uses pure tap water still. I had a RO unit in the past but didn't like the amount of wastage as the unit gave about 1 litre of good for every 10+ of waste. Even the garden didn't need that much.

Next pay I'll grab a RO again, primarily for top ups and to reduce phosphates and to adjust TDS if necessary, but that currently sits around 150 - 170 without too many issues, bit of calcium from a Reef Builders mix goes in each couple of weeks but only a capful if that.

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kunzy

i use rain water from the tank... havnt had any problems for a good year now

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h20rat

I just did a quick baseline test of filtered water so I know where things are at before anything. Was kind of surprised that there seems to be traces of ammonia, nitrates and nitrites already! I'm thinking the ammonia is a false positive which I read elsewhere here was a result of chemical used in town water so not really phased by that. The others though?

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BlueBolts

The charcoal filter in Brita's removes metals..etc, basically a charcoal (coconut) filter, and it's design is not intended to theoretically purify water. TDS levels will only slightly reduce (my tap water went from 380 to 320).... Wasn't impressed, so it's now used for water poured into my coffee machine.

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h20rat

I use for exactly the same purpose! ;) I'm just prepping some straight out of tap with conditioner to see the diff. I'm going to have to get some peat moss to put into filter to drop my ph a bit I fear...it ain't coming down, I thought it might move as a result of cycling but nothing.

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blindfisherman
I'm one of those that uses pure tap water still. I had a RO unit in the past but didn't like the amount of wastage as the unit gave about 1 litre of good for every 10+ of waste. Even the garden didn't need that much.

Next pay I'll grab a RO again' date=' primarily for top ups and to reduce phosphates and to adjust TDS if necessary, but that currently sits around 150 - 170 without too many issues, bit of calcium from a Reef Builders mix goes in each couple of weeks but only a capful if that.[/quote']

10:1 is appaling. what ro unit was doing this?

I think mine is more 1:1 or at worst 6:4, waste: useful water.

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h20rat

Never realised how much water needed to go through them! That's full on! I wonder what those ceramic filters pull out?

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jayc
I just did a quick baseline test of filtered water so I know where things are at before anything. Was kind of surprised that there seems to be traces of ammonia' date=' nitrates and nitrites already! I'm thinking the ammonia is a false positive which I read elsewhere here was a result of chemical used in town water so not really phased by that. The others though?[/quote']

Check your tap water, straight out of the tap unfiltered.

With the rains and floods recently, most councils have upped the amount of Chloramines in our water.

Sydney water out of the tap has between 0.25 - 0.50 ammonia.

If you test kit is reading ammonia, it's AMMONIA. Nothing false positive about it. Chloramines break down into ammonia.

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h20rat

Thanks jayc yep its a consistent 0.25 for ammonia from whatever source...nil nitrites and somewhere between 10-20ppm nitrates could the consistency between the ammo and nitrates be due to chloramines?

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jayc

To disinfect water using chloramines, ammonia is added to previously chlorine-treated water. Our municipal water treatment systems have made the switch from using chlorines to using chloramines instead, for the disinfection of water. Hence our test kits detecting ammonia in our tap water. The levels of ammonia/chloramine added by our councils will rise and fall depending on the weather. Heavy rains washing crap into our dams mean that more ammonia/chloramine need to be added to keep our drinking water safe.

One of the factors resulting in the destruction of chloramines is the presence of nitrifying microbes in the water mains.

In municipal water systems chloramines are used to establish residual disinfectant levels to maintain disinfected water throughout the mains. Some of the mains may take as long as a day or two for water from the treatment plant to reach the end of the main and therefore it is very important for them to keep a minimum level of disinfectant in place. However, it turns out that sometimes nitrifiers can colonize the pipes and sit there consuming the chloramines. At that point the council have to go in, flush the main and then super-chlorinate that section, re-flush the main, etc.

The presence of Nitrates in your tap water would indicate that there are nitrifying microbes somewhere along the length of piping between your house and the council supply. That's the only reason for the presence of Nitrates straight out of the tap. There must be Nitrifying bacteria converting the nitrites into nitrates.

Standard tap water conditioners use sodium triosulfate to convert the chlorine component of chloramine to chloride. As you know, there is free ammonia in the water as a result. This also increases the ammonia level.

That's why we all recommend using a water conditioner that not only converts chlorine/chloramine into chloride, but also converts the resulting ammonia into non-toxic ammonium. Seachem Prime, Tetra AquaSafe NH/CL Formula, Jungle's ACE, Kordon AmQuel, and Kent Professional Ammonia Detox will all do the job. If the label doesn't specifically mention that it neutralizes ammonia, then don't depend on it to safely treat water containing chloramines. Ammonium is less toxic than Ammonia, but is still toxic. The nitrifying bacterial colony in our filters and substrate will take care of the ammonium.

When chloramines are removed, ammonia may be released. Ammonia causes corrosion of lead and copper, of which most water pipes are made. (Orthophosphates may be added to reduce corrosion.)

Lead and Copper is not good for shrimp keepers. Also note the source of phospates that could be entering our tanks.

Let's see ... what else does our government add to our water ...

Fluoride. Supposedly to help our teeth. But how does it affect the health of our fish or shrimp?

Hydrated Lime to buffer the pH on our tap water. They need to do this to prevent pH falling and becoming acidic - thereby corroding the mains pipes. Hydrated Lime can be linked to a whole range of diseases, primarily fungal infections.

Prime can neutralise Chlorine/Chloramine (and give your fish a slime coat - whatever) but it can't remove heavy metals, hydrated lime, fluoride. I know of only one water conditioner that can do that, but that's a topic for another thread.

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ineke

Wow jayc scary stuff really but thank you for an excellent write up. Can't wait for the other thread about the conditioner. One thing with any community is we all do whatever is recommended but often we do it without understanding and when you ask but why the answer is because thats what we have always done. Well done:encouragement:

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jayc

Yeah sounds scary, but only in the context of water for fish/shrimp.

The water treatment is meant to keep it safe for human consumption, in that aspect the chems used in the water works well.

Just not so good for our aquarium livestock.

I'm going to post a thread tonight / tomorrow on that alternate water conditioner in the Water Parameter subforum.

The results seeing in my tanks since using it speaks volumes.

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h20rat

Thanks for your wisdom jayc. I'm using the shrimp water conditioner from fluvial...god I sound like a fan boy...it was just there and I grabbed it, gives dosage to remove chloramines so this would present in new tank as ammonia then? Or neutralized as something else?

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jayc
Thanks for your wisdom jayc. I'm using the shrimp water conditioner from fluvial...god I sound like a fan boy...it was just there and I grabbed it' date=' gives dosage to remove chloramines so this would present in new tank as ammonia then? Or neutralized as something else?[/quote']

If it says it removes chloramine, then it will convert ammonia to the less toxic ammonium.

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blindfisherman

Is the product you are talking about the hikari ultimate water conditioner by any chance?

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Squiggle

I think he's talking about the Fluval Shrimp Safe :encouragement:

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h20rat

Jayc thank you for explaining and your patience. Squiggle...spot on :) ill give it a rest day tomorrow see what things are like on the other side :)

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blindfisherman
I think he's talking about the Fluval Shrimp Safe :encouragement:

I dont think jayc is talking about fluval :s or maybe he is.

The hikari ultimate removes heavy metals though

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jayc

LOL :confused:

I was responding to H2Orat's question about "...gives dosage to remove chloramines so this would present in new tank as ammonia then? Or neutralized as something else?"

h2Orat had not mentioned what brand at that time. I was addressing his question about what the water conditioner would neutralise chloramines to. The answer was ammonium. Good water conditioners will not turn Chloramines to ammonia since this is more toxic to fish/shrimp.

It was Squiggle that guessed Fluval Shrimp Safe.

In either case, both Fluval Shrimp Safe and Hikari Ultimate Water Conditioner are both capable of removing Chloramines, Chlorine, and converting Ammonia, Nitirite and heavy metals.

HOWEVER, I'd like to introduce everyone in Shrimp Keepers forum to another product that does more, cost less and is made in Aust !!

It's not new, but it's not as widely known as say Seachem's Prime.

And no, I'm not affiliated with this product. I'm just a happy customer.

Just give me a couple of hours to finish typing out that new thread.

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blindfisherman

Supa chlor by g and k?

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jayc
Supa chlor by g and k?

Hell YEAH !

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