My inline canister experiment

[hsoje]

Im trying a new canister set-up on my Mishchling and TB tank, some may say over kill but theres nothing like insurance on a tank full of TB. Really i was just bored on the weekend. :P

Anyway heres basically how ive set it up

1x eheim 2213

1x pre-filter with filter wool

1x pre-filter with media + K1

1x pre-filter with media

so inflow goes to a pre-filter filled with Filter-wool then feeding to Eheim 2213 filled with media. Then the outflow of the canister goes directly into the top of the first media chamber with K1 tumbling from the flow followed by the bottom of the pre-filter chamber filled with media then moving onto the final chamber containing Mr Aqua media.

Kinda complicated but maybe this should help

Heres a vid

Not sure how the K1 will behave as is matures. Im just experimenting at this stage. I based this idea off how the japs use multiple canisters in line to acheive Anaerobic Bacteria.

Mine is essential the same in the idea that by the time water reaches the final chamber it will be depleted of oxygen which then Anaerobic bacteria takes over breaking down nitrate.

other advantages are the flow rate is reduced since the filter system is installed in such a small tank 38lt, added water volume & not needing touch media chambers only replacing the wool every month or so.

Im sure this have been done before just thought id share

[torface]

Wow looks intense!! Are you not worried it will ruin the motor?

I've wanted to do this for removing nitrates but I only currently own one canister.

[kunzy]

neat setup!! and yes it might run down the motor? let us know i have a few spare canisters lying around might do the same!!

[Squiggle]

Very nice dude, keep us updated on how this works out for you, definitely looks like you need an engineering degree to put it together, lol :victorious:

[durro68]

Mate where did you get those prefilters?

[hsoje]

Thanks guys for your thoughts...as for ruining the motor yes this is a possibility I have considered but for the time being seems to be handling ok...

Very nice dude, keep us updated on how this works out for you, definitely looks like you need an engineering degree to put it together, lol :victorious:

I'll defiantly keep everyone posted... Squiggle im lucky enough to have a engineering degree but I don't think telco engineering helped me much in this case.

[hsoje]

Mate where did you get those prefilters?

A LFS in Sydney not sure if I'm allowed to mention... I grabbed all the stock he had but.. Lol

[Squiggle]

Hahaha, maybe you can put a transmission tower on top of it, should get good reception after that...........& a nice tumor or two! lmao

[hsoje]

Hahaha' date=' maybe you can put a transmission tower on top of it, should get good reception after that...........& a nice tumor or two! lmao [/quote']

ahaha a base station would be nice but I'm leaning towards running fibre to all of my tanks,, ill show NBN how it's done and it won't take 10years...

[Squiggle]

Hahaha, then you can have some surfin shrimp & they can join the forum :stupid:

[hsoje]

squiggle ive just had second thoughts that maybe a transmission tower could be a good idea... All the guys i know that work on the Radio side of things say that they all have girls.....

Would it be wrong to give shrimp radiation to increase Female numbers lol?

[Squiggle]

Hahaha, sounds like a good plan

[khemo]

Be careful with those prefilters mate. The connection on mine broke/snapped off (not the strongest material) and the whole tank ended up on the floor.

[fishmosy]

Hey mate, interesting set-up.

Since the idea is to get anaerobic conditions, have you given thought to 1. carbon dosing or 2. how to re-oxygenate the water before it returns to the shrimp tank?

1. Under anaerobic conditions, the bacteria need a carbon or sulphur source to be able to break down nitrate. Some people use vodka, others proprietary carbon sources (beads), and others use sulphur beads instead.

2. Nitrate filters are usually run in a loop from/to a sump because the water coming out of them has no oxygen and needs to be oxygenated before it is returned to the main tank.

So if you run your filters inline back to your tank, the water returning will have no/little oxygen, a sure fire way to kill any shrimp no matter how much you aerate your tank.

[smicko]

Thats an intense looking setup, do you still need to do regular water change or just top ups? I could see that running a well stocked system with no changes to water parameters for years, absolutely magic insurance for an expensive tank.

There is a new product in Australia called nitrate guard. Basically works the same as carbon dosing without the ongoing effort and its just a bag of media with an airstone. Maybe one of the sponsors could look at getting this. It's supposed let you go months without water changing.

There is a trial underway on another forum (sorry about that mention) that I am awaiting results on. Sounds good but maybe too good.

Cheers mick

[fishmosy]

Nitrate isn't the only important water parameter for shrimp. For example, uptake of carbonates by the shrimp for their skeletons will reduce the level of carbonates in the water over time, and need to be replenished. You are going to need to do a water change at some stage.

That said, I'm interested to see the reviews on this product. I think it could be useful for keeping nitrate levels down in between water changes, especially in overstocked or grow-out tanks for fish. Perhaps extend the time between water changes?

[Squiggle]

Yeah I'm part of that trial mick & so far I'm not impressed with my results but I've only had it in the tank for a few days, I know it hasn't had a chance to start working yet but in a matter of hours it shot my TDS up 400ppm which won't effect fish it I'm hoping the shrimp will pull through from such a massive change :dejection:

[fishmosy]

I wonder if the increase in TDS is going to be a nail in the coffin against using this product for shrimp. Interesting.

[smicko]

Yeah I'm part of that trial mick & so far I'm not impressed with my results but I've only had it in the tank for a few days' date=' I know it hasn't had a chance to start working yet but in a matter of hours it shot my TDS up 400ppm which won't effect fish it I'm hoping the shrimp will pull through from such a massive change :dejection:[/quote']

Holy crap, I wouldn't have expected that, I hope it works out for you.

Did you keep running it or take it straight off?

Cheers mick

[Squiggle]

I'll definitely keep you guys updated, I'm not sure if it's just an initial jump or if it will keep climbing, if it is just an initial jump then it may have a saving grace by using it on another tank first the swapping to the shrimp tanks :confused: I was pretty stunned to find out that one day my TDS is 100 & the next it's 500, at first I thought the pen might have stuffed up but I've got two TDS pens & an EC pen so it was pretty easy to check :encouragement:

[smicko]

Nitrate isn't the only important water parameter for shrimp. For example' date=' uptake of carbonates by the shrimp for their skeletons will reduce the level of carbonates in the water over time, and need to be replenished. You are going to need to do a water change at some stage.

That said, I'm interested to see the reviews on this product. I think it could be useful for keeping nitrate levels down in between water changes, especially in overstocked or grow-out tanks for fish. Perhaps extend the time between water changes?[/quote']

Thats why I said it sounds too good. Would topping up evaporation add enough minerals etc in a small tank setup?

I think overstocked and large systems is where it will work. I am interested in it for the pond. But after squiggles experience its not looking good early on.

Cheers mick

[Squiggle]

Holy crap' date=' I wouldn't have expected that, I hope it works out for you.

Did you keep running it or take it straight off?

Cheers mick[/quote']

My thoughts exactly dude, no I haven't taken it out as it's a test & I have to see it through otherwise I can't have an accurate assessment of the product, hopefully it just an initial spike & WC's will bring it back down :encouragement:

[fishmosy]

Would topping up evaporation add enough minerals etc in a small tank setup?

Cheers mick

Theres two problems depending on what you do.

If you use RO to top up, you are going to have the reduction in carbonates over time (also messing with TDS, pH, ect).

If you use remineralised water/tapwater you have the opposite problem, you will increase the amount of carbonates in your tank, increasing TDS and messing with pH, ect.

Easy solution, water changes.

[smicko]

Thanks fishmosy, chemistry isnt my strong suit. I understand enough to get me by but alot less than you.

I must admit water changing 20% on a 10 000 litre pond is painfully slow lol.

Also sorry for the hijack.

Cheers mick

[hsoje]

Thanks for everyone's commentskhemo thanks mate the LFS I bought them from actually warned me about the delicate fittings.

Hey mate, interesting set-up. Since the idea is to get anaerobic conditions, have you given thought to 1. carbon dosing or 2. how to re-oxygenate the water before it returns to the shrimp tank? 1. Under anaerobic conditions, the bacteria need a carbon or sulphur source to be able to break down nitrate. Some people use vodka, others proprietary carbon sources (beads), and others use sulphur beads instead. 2. Nitrate filters are usually run in a loop from/to a sump because the water coming out of them has no oxygen and needs to be oxygenated before it is returned to the main tank. So if you run your filters inline back to your tank, the water returning will have no/little oxygen, a sure fire way to kill any shrimp no matter how much you aerate your tank.

Fishmosy obviously more research into this setup needs to be done.I haven't looked at carbon dosing, my original idea was to just increase the amount of biological media in my filtration system and to be able to not touch the media chambers just the filter wool. Then the thought jumped to mind that maby by the last chamber there would be limited oxygen in the water that would promote anaerobic bacteria this nitrate removal. Sounds like I only got half of the equation right.ill grab a oxygen test kit to help monitor oxygen levels, ill test water along the system to help gauge how much oxygen is being depleted through the process.last thing I want is to come home to a tank of dead TB!!!!!! I might drown myself in the tank after lol. Ill have to get back to you when I've done some more research on carbon/sulfur doseing and re oxygenating the water on return to tank.thanks josh