Extremely High GH Issue - Red Cherry Shrimp

[professionalshrimphugger]

Hello all,

I am new to the forum, although experienced at fishkeeping, I am relatively new to shrimpkeeping.

Let's start with my issue. I had started a colony of 18 juvenile cherry shrimp (Neocaridina davidi) in a 20 gallon long as of last month. I solely use tap water and change 5% per week. They are the only inhabitants alongside a single juvenile Malaysian trumpet snail. Today the numbers have been reduced to 9.

The deaths did not start until the shrimp turned into adults, where they have struggled, twitching as if provoked, becoming lethargic, and eventually flipping over to their side and dying. Only the ones on the verge of death exhibit this behavior, whereas the rest simply graze on as usual.

I measured my parameters today - my tank has been established for two months as of now and is densely planted. They have never bred despite being of adult size and having visible saddles. Never an issue with molting.

• Ammonia: 0 ppm, Nitrite: 0 ppm, Nitrate: 0-5 ppm || pH: 7.8, GH: ??, KH: 3

I cannot get a single good read off API's liquid GH test. I have dropped beyond 30+ and gave up as I knew the numbers were already extreme. The thing is, I need a temporary, inexpensive solution to keep my shrimp safe. I believe by the time I order supplies, the colony would already give.

I was planning on moving the colony to a 5.5g, barren with my floating plants and mosses, using just distilled water, Seachem Equilibrium (only GH additive I own) and crushed eggshells (potential source of KH). Possibly crushed coral to substitute for the lack of any real mineral additive.

I did not believe that high GH would possibly become a problem, and I am fortunate that the strugglers are still alive.

If anyone has a solution to this problem, or approve of my plan of action, please let me know.

TIA

[sdlTBfanUK]

Sorry to hear you are having a problem!

Where are you based in the world?

Can you test your tapwater GH/KH/PH? Best to know what the source water is, dechlorinated (if required) before you have ADDED anything.

Are you sure the GH test is working and not old, or already activated/contaminated somehow? The other parameters seem ok! If the GH is as ridiculousy high as you say then I expect the shrimps would have problems molting (they may be twitching to get out of the old shell), though generally twitchy behaviour is usually down to some sort of toxic poisoning or the aquarium not being properly cycled?

Are you using any plant fertiser or CO2? 

Did you drip acclimate the shrimp over many hours before adding them to the aquarium? They are much more sensitive than fish to changes in water parameters etc.

You could end up killing more of them by moving them so I would hold off from that at the moment!

 

[professionalshrimphugger]

United States.

I have tested my tap water; it yields the same results. GH: ??, KH: 3, pH: 7.8.

I cannot say for sure if my GH test is faulty or not, the expiration is until 2023. It's more of a twitching, then stasis. I have one shrimp that's having a hard time balancing itself, but it's swimmerets and mouth keep moving in attempt in getting back up. I allowed it to stick to my sponge filter.

The tank is cycled. I used established media. Readings would not show 0 otherwise.

I do use EI Dosing, half dosage recommended for a 20 gallon. It has been said on other forums that it does not affect shrimp, but I stopped dosing to isolate variables a week ago. No CO2, that's too costly for me, hah.

I drip acclimated the shrimp for 2 hours, 1 drop per second.

I tested for copper in my tank, nothing. Funnily enough, my mystery snails in my community tank don't seem too affected by it.

[jayc]

11 hours ago, professionalshrimphugger said:

The deaths did not start until the shrimp turned into adults, where they have struggled, twitching as if provoked, becoming lethargic, and eventually flipping over to their side and dying. Only the ones on the verge of death exhibit this behavior, whereas the rest simply graze on as usual.

8 hours ago, professionalshrimphugger said:

It's more of a twitching, then stasis. I have one shrimp that's having a hard time balancing itself, but it's swimmerets and mouth keep moving in attempt in getting back up.

These are all classic symptoms of shrimp moulting problems.

 

11 hours ago, professionalshrimphugger said:

They have never bred despite being of adult size and having visible saddles.

Again, another high GH symptom. High GH not only causes harder carapace (shell), but it also makes eggs harder. When the egg is harder the male finds it more difficult to fertilise the eggs.

 

11 hours ago, professionalshrimphugger said:

I cannot get a single good read off API's liquid GH test. I have dropped beyond 30+ and gave up as I knew the numbers were already extreme

That's a worry if you can't get a good GH reading because that is going to be most likely issue right now for you.

 

8 hours ago, professionalshrimphugger said:

Funnily enough, my mystery snails in my community tank don't seem too affected by it.

Because snails don't moult. 

 

If you dont already have a TDS meter, I suggest getting one asap. It's another test to narrow down your water parameters, and not have to trust one test by it's own - in this case the GH test kit. I would wager your water parameter is too high in dissolved minerals - likely from the tap water source, fertiliser dosing and/or any rocks/crushed corals you might have in the tank.

To remedy this, you need to start doing water changes with RO, distilled or rain water immediately. I would do a 50% water change with RO water asap.

Then look for sources that increase GH in the tank and eliminate it - fertilisers, rocks, crush corals, shells. 

 

It's difficult to save a shrimp who's carapace is already too hard, but hopefully any younger shrimps will benefit from the water change and the reduced GH.

 

Good luck and keep us updated.

[sdlTBfanUK]

You may end up losing this batch entirely but then you can start completely fresh and get the aquarium set up right for the next batch of shrimp!

If you do any large water changes then try and add the new water slowly, either dripper or some other way.

You should get yourself a TDS meter (as JayC above), they are cheap and readily available. You should always use a GH tester kit as well with shrimps, if you do the 50% water change that should halve the GH so you should get a reading after that, or if you can get a local fish store to test it for you that will give you an idea of the GH.

If your water supply is as hard as it appears it may be you will need to mull over how (or even IF) you want to keep shrimps as that may mean using RO or distilled/bottled water and buying a proper shrimp specific remineraliser? That will be quite expensive but you won't then have to mess about adding crushed coral/eggshells etc, but only you can decide whether you want to do/spend that much etc? If you live somewhere that gets a lot of rain, then you can use rain water?

Also, as JayC states, you need to know what you are using/adding to the water and aquarium, ie fertilizers, rocks. Unless you have very exotic plants you shouldn't need any fertilizers.

Just as a note, we have come across quite a few experienced fish keeprs that have this sort of start off issues with shrimp. Shrimp are more difficult than fish, and the aquarium and water etc need to be ready and within the required parameters before getting the shrimps. Usually people jump in, get the shrimps before everything is ready/sorted. Hopefully though you will keep at it, or if this lot die you will have another go and we can help you get it sorted?