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Fish room, breed for profit and licencing.


nathanaldo07
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I posted a thread a couple of days ago titles; 'Shipping live aquatics in the UK. How can I do this? Can I do this?' and in that thread I said I wanted to breed for fun on a small scale. However, after looking at figures I have been wondering if I could implement this 'breed for profit' business model into my business, based on eBay. I am unsure as to how much profit is to be made, but this still isn't my priority as my main focus would be on breeding. I would want to only focus on breeding shrimp and snails. I have made this thread today, again to ask for your advice on how I can actually do this properly. I would want to be able to ensure I will not be hit with a fine for not having a license, but also so I can create a setup which can produce high quality, high grade, healthy Aquatic Invertebrates.

My first question is, again, regarding licencing and the 'Pet Shop Licence' specifically. This is because I would be producing and selling enough shrimp/snails to where it would no longer be considered as selling the offspring of a pet. However, I am unsure as to whether I would actually need this licence as The Pet Animals Act 1951 (Revised 2018) states that '“animal” includes any description of vertebrate;', which I'm assuming means that only vertebrate animals require us to have a licence. And given that Shrimp and snails are Invertebrates, I would not need a licence to sell them?

My second question is in regard to the set-up. Where is the cheapest place to get fish tanks, around 45 litres (10 gallons) in size? I have seen many things about the 'dollar per gallon sale' which Americans are lucky enough to get. I was wondering if there are any sales like this that go on in the UK, as a sale like this would mean I'd be spending ~£10 per tank as opposed to ~£50 per tank (which is the cheapest I have seen.)
I was think as far as to try get them from manufacturers and buy them through the business like I was going to sell them myself, just to cut out the middle man. 😉


My third question is also related to the legal side of things, would I be able to have this set up in a shed in the garden without any problems? This shed would be of a size to where it does not require me to get planning permission.
 

Okay so the plan...

Start off with one rack (1800mm high x 1200mm long x 450mm deep) with 3 shelves with an even spacing between each one (maximum weight per shelf is 300kg). each shelf would have 3 45l tanks, so a total of 9 tanks. All of this would preferably be inside of an insulated, heated shed in the garden big enough to accommodate multiple tanks.

Each tank would have a Hamburg matten filter in the shape of a regular sponge filter (the image below) powered by a shared air pump (shared between the tanks on that shelf.) each tank will be lit by a 10W 800 lumen led floodlight.
DSC_0790-1.jpg
Each tank which needs a higher temperature will have a heater but I would aim to just heat the room to save on cost.

I would also want to have all of the tanks connected to a drain for ease when it comes to water changes.

What I would like to breed...

In terms of shrimp, I would want to breed:

  • Neocaridina davidi
    • Red cherry shrimp
    • Orange sakura shrimp
    • Yellow sakura shrimp
    • Green jade shrimp
    • Blue velvet shrimp
    • Black rose shrimp

In terms of snails, I would want to breed:

  • Bladder snails
  • Ramshorn snails
    • Pink variation
    • Blue variation
  • Assassin snails
  • Malaysian trumpet snails
  • Apple snails (Gold variation)
  • Rabbit/ elephant snails

I am fully aware that some of these are harder to breed than others, however, these are the best ones I've found in terms of ease of breeding and sales on ebay.

I am also aware that all these species will not be able to fit into just 9 tanks and breed successfully, I would want to do species and variation only tanks (e.g. pink ramshons in one tank and blue ramshorns in another.)

If anybody has any recommendations/ changes they would make to this set up then I would really appreciate hearing them. 🙂

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Thats a lot to take in and for you to undertake. You would need to spek to (or hope someone comes on here) who knows about the legal side, but there are so many people doing what you plan that I can't imagine there is much too it, unless others are just not as bothered as you are? You could try contacting some direct or suppliers like Proshrimp but I don't know how helpful they will want to be to what they will see as competition?

I know of the USA deals of $1 a galoon sales but I have never come acrss anything like that over here and the main problem will be the expense of purchasing all the equipment, shed, electrics, to the point I can't really see you would make any profit in the first few years, not to mention the work you wil have to put in............ - I suspect most ebayers are more hobbyists trying to recoup some of the expenses but not really making any profit! Again, you could ask suppliers ike Proshrimp whether they can do you a deal on a job lot of tanks or whether they know where to go, otherwise it wiould be a case of second hand from ebay, or new from amazon etc.

You may be able to mix snails and shrimps in one tank (one type of each), especially to start off with which would give you enough tanks!

I hope that someone may come on here with the sort of help you want, but this isn't a UK specific website but used by all countries so it may be quite unlikely, but fingers crossed.

Personally I wouldn't bother with the black rose as unless you have an empty tank they will be a bit too difficult to see, I would get bloody mary or blue dream instead!

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10 minutes ago, sdlTBfanUK said:

Thats a lot to take in and for you to undertake. You would need to spek to (or hope someone comes on here) who knows about the legal side, but there are so many people doing what you plan that I can't imagine there is much too it, unless others are just not as bothered as you are? You could try contacting some direct or suppliers like Proshrimp but I don't know how helpful they will want to be to what they will see as competition?

I know of the USA deals of $1 a galoon sales but I have never come acrss anything like that over here and the main problem will be the expense of purchasing all the equipment, shed, electrics, to the point I can't really see you would make any profit in the first few years, not to mention the work you wil have to put in............ - I suspect most ebayers are more hobbyists trying to recoup some of the expenses but not really making any profit! Again, you could ask suppliers ike Proshrimp whether they can do you a deal on a job lot of tanks or whether they know where to go, otherwise it wiould be a case of second hand from ebay, or new from amazon etc.

You may be able to mix snails and shrimps in one tank (one type of each), especially to start off with which would give you enough tanks!

I hope that someone may come on here with the sort of help you want, but this isn't a UK specific website but used by all countries so it may be quite unlikely, but fingers crossed.

Personally I wouldn't bother with the black rose as unless you have an empty tank they will be a bit too difficult to see, I would get bloody mary or blue dream instead!

Thanks very much for your advice. maybe it would be a better idea for me to slowly acquire the supplies needed to spread the cost out and slowly grow to the point where I can have a shed with racks in it.

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3 hours ago, nathanaldo07 said:

slowly acquire the supplies needed to spread the cost out and slowly grow to the point where I can have a shed with racks in it.

This sounds like a better idea. Start off with one shelf (3x tanks) and get acquainted to to the whole process of breeding shrimp first. 

As for purchasing tanks, can you find a glazier or fish tank maker? Often it's cheaper buying direct than through a retailer.

I'm no lawyer, so I can't comment on your 3rd question. But if you start small, it's can be considered as a hobby, no?

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2 hours ago, jayc said:

This sounds like a better idea. Start off with one shelf (3x tanks) and get acquainted to to the whole process of breeding shrimp first. 

As for purchasing tanks, can you find a glazier or fish tank maker? Often it's cheaper buying direct than through a retailer.

I'm no lawyer, so I can't comment on your 3rd question. But if you start small, it's can be considered as a hobby, no?

I'm sure that as long as i am not selling too much (which i doubt i will at the beginning) then I should be fine. 

 

Someone close by has just put up a listing on ebay selling their fish room for £550 but with the option to buy just part of it rather than the whole thing. i could get 1x 48"x12"x24" tank 1x 30"x12"x18" tank and one 18"x18"x18" cube tank all for just £100. i was thinking I could just split the tanks up? i don't know though because this does kind of go against everything I have just said as i would be able to split them up to get 8 tanks greater than 45l.

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Having tanks of different sizes like that would make setting up the fish room more difficult, especially compared to the neat rack idea first envisaged. It will also mean more work and maintenance, etc. I woiuld just get 2 of the original ons you planned to get if you have room for them in the house (for now) and try 2 different shrimps and 2 different snails and just see how you get on  with those, then when they breed and you get enough you can sell those and you at least will have the full process knowledge/experience before commiting fully, and if you decide to do the full shed as before at least the tanks you have will be the right ones for that rack and therefore reuseable!

Havihg said all that if there is someone locally selling their whole fish room (depending whether that has everything you want/need) for £550, that is a great price (they would probably accept £500 and if they are close there woudn't be too much 'moving' involved so you may want to think very carefully on that as that sort of deal/setup may not be around later - SODS law! There will still be a LOT of work though setting it all up, buidling the shed etc etc. Shrimp tanks don't need deep water, usually a foot or so is deep enough, it is the base area that is more important as that is where they spend their time, and the greater the base surface area the more biofilm will grow!

I still think I would start with a couple of tanks though so you can get a little experience first.

One other thing to consider is the water source, so you should get the parameters of your tap water (take some in a jar to a local fish store if you dont want to get all the test kits at this stage). Cherry shrimp can 'normally' be kept in tap water IF it has the right parameters (mine does here luckily). Otherwise you are looking at RO water and mineralisers etc. Being some where that has hard tap water could be costly. If it turns out you need to use RO water you could use a ZEROWATER filter jug if you are just trying out with a couple of tanks, but a full setup will then need the full RO equipment!

Edited by sdlTBfanUK
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    • jayc
      Keep doing this, and feeding it the medicated food. If the shrimp doesn't eat the food within a day, remove it and feed new medicated food again the next day.   You sir, are a good candidate for an RO filter. Your shrimp are not going to like the hard water in the long term.
    • alkemist
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    • jayc
      Is the shrimp still in the main tank? Or have you moved it into a separate container? There should be no biofilm in a new container, and it should be hungry to want to eat the medicated algae wafer. It won't go away without treatment. The bacteria is not just on the shell (carapace), so moulting won't get rid of the bacteria.
    • alkemist
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    • alkemist
      Ok, thanks. I'll do that. Yes, I have the tub lightly aerated.
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