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supermansteve32

Help with dying shrimp

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supermansteve32

So I tested my TDS the past 6 days. Readings were: 113, 123, 114, 130, 114, 108.

I believe when I tested my TDS before (200) it was right after a water change, and the Gh RO water I was going to instill the particles hadn't yet settled. 

Not too sure, but I'll hold off on water changes until it's closer to 200.

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jayc

That guesstimate of 120 TDS from the previous page was pretty bang on based on your last 6 readings. 

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sdlTBfanUK

When I do the TDS readiing I swoosh it through the water rather than just putting it in one place and that should help mix the water and clear any dirt from the prongs!

I would aim for the TDS of about 150 but don't wait for it to go up to 200 now. Assuming the earlier readings of 200ish were incorrect so can be ignored now, I would just get back to your regular weekly maintenance/water change and mix the new water to about 140-150 and you should be all set.

Simon

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supermansteve32

Okay so I haven't done a water change in weeks because I thought the TDS needed to get closer to 150 before changing and my TDS meter continually kept reading 108 to 114. Sho I went and bought a new TDS meter and it's different from my old one.  The new one vs my old one: my water in tank 147 vs 103, water using the correct salty shrimp mix to RO water 88 vs 66. So I'm going with the reading on my new TDS meter. 

So it's time for a water change.  Should I replace the water with the 88 TDS or put some more mix in until it's above 100 (since CRS parameters should be 100-200)?

Thanks again everyone

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sdlTBfanUK

As you are aiming for TDS150 and the tank is near that now at 147 you just make the new water up to near as you can TDS150 and if you keep topping up with pure RO water between changes this would be the normal routine from now.

Getting a new TDS meter was the right thing to do as they are cheap enough and hopefully it will be more accurate? As someone said before, you can get a rough idea of whether the TDS reading is right by doing a GH test as using RO water and remineraliser those figures should be related. Probably best to test some mineralised water before you put it in the tank though!

Good that you haven't lost any more shrimps, hopefully that continues and all should be straight forward now.

Simon

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supermansteve32

I came home from being away for 2 days and there was another adolescent shrimp dead. I saw the water temp was 83. I know they like to have 70 to 78. Would 83 kill some shrimp? 

Also I first started doing water changes again and I had to do a little extra a few days later because there was a little mold I had to siphon out. Not sure if that's the reason either. Also my water TDS stayed between 142-147 this whole time. 

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sdlTBfanUK

I would think that is possible as that is pretty much the upper limit I think, and of coarse how accurate is the thermometer - I have 4 different methods and all produce different readings so it may have been a bit higher???

Mould isn't usually a problem other than it looks horrid and usually will just disappear after a tank is properly run in and as far as I know not harmful to shrimps. I have had it in most of my tanks at the start, usually on wood or something similar and either removed the item it grows on or just leave it and it gradually disappears within a month (usually less).

I hope you manage to get the temperature back to normal and it sounds like you have mastered the TDS. I'm not sure where you are based, is it somewhere hot (I apologise if you have said and I have forgotten)?

Simon

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supermansteve32

Yes. I live in Texas. When I'm away freon the house I'll have only one of my AC units running so the cats don't die. 

The mold was caused by some food the shrimp didn't eat. 

I did a temp check with my other probe  and it was almost 2 degrees higher. I guess I'll leave the fans on when I leave now

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sdlTBfanUK

My brother just moved from San Antonio to Florida!

It may be more economic to purchase a specific chiller for the shrimp tank, we don't have that problem here though I did cook mine, 33 degrees if I remember, d'oh (faulty heater)! I assume you can get one for a large tank like yours?

There are a number of foods that are probably easier and don't go mouldy, like snowflake which is soya bean husks and can be left in the tank for long periods and is therefore better if you are going away for a period. Indian Almond leaves are good for holiday periods as well because they decay very slowly and 'stuff' the shrimp like grow on them. Probably if you are just going away for a few days you may be better not to feed and if there are Indian almond leaves etc in the tank they should have enough to eat.

Hopefully you caught the temperature in enough time that you won't loose any more shrimps.

Simon 

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CurleyJones321

excuse me for interjecting, i apreciate you people most certainly have more experiance than me with shrimp keeping but i've just regailed myself with this whole thread and thought id through in my 2 cents.

Crystal red shrimp prefer a TDS range of between 100 & 150. I've Obviously had problems that ive now pretty much solved where i was trying to lower TDS But now that i have got things stabilising i am playing around with raising TDS and here is how i see it... only ever do between 10 & 20% water changes at a time but this can be done twice a day. with you large tank a dripper may not be appropriate but you should also make sure you are temperature adjusting your water before you add it and only ever try to adjust TDS by 10% higher than it was at a time (i know i had a to do it this way before i got my dripper). FYI Crystal reds prefer a range of temperature between 21 & 26C (61 & 79F). I also my experience so far is that GH & KH aren't that important but your dGH of 6 is on the high end of acceptable for Crystal Red's.

there is also 2 piece's of information you seem to be failing to provide and that is Nitrite (N02) &  Nitrate (N03) which are apart of the ammonia (NH4) cycle but all tough i have read quite high numbers for these i have never read any ammonia readings. Shrimp are VERY sensitive to N02 & N03 and from my research for Crystal Red shrimp Nitrate should not be above 5PPM and Nitrite should be at 0 but if my tolerance range for my Red Cherry Shrimp is anything to go by and that is a maximum of 20PPM Nitrate you should not have any reading above 0.05PPM. i think high readings of these Chemicals are what could be killing your shrimp and your not aware of it because your only reading Ammonia GH and TDS.

Sorry if that comes across as over bearing but thats my opinion and im trying to help :)

Kind regards


James

Edited by CurleyJones321
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jayc

Some good reminders there James.

@supermansteve32, 83degF was when you measured it, it could have been higher at some point in time while you were away.

CRS will fall to higher temps faster than high GH or KH or Nitrates. So get temps under control as a priority. Then think about keeping Nitrates under control. That is where your regular water changes are crucial. While small water changes are recommended, don't be afraid to perform large water changes in order to correct parameters that have gone wildly off course. Sometimes a large water change every 12 months is a good idea to reset the mineral build up in the tank and replenish calcium & magnesium that have been lost - where TDS seem to be too high despite regular water changes. As long as you take caution in matching parameters to the shrimp's needs and slowly dripping the new water back in, large water changes don't have to be feared. We just don't want to be changing parameters by too much, too often, so small water changes are usually recommended.

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sdlTBfanUK

From years of reading as well it is A LOT simpler with the bigger tanks to keep parameters steady than the 'normal' smaller tanks so they need a lot more monitoring!

I agree with JayC about not fearing large changes as long as they are done very cautiously. You only have to think back to nature and if there is a heavy rain storm obviously the TDS will be reduced quickly as the rain has 000TDS so would lower the overall TDS of the river/pond - wherever they are, and it could be quick/drastic.

I think it is best to be cautious and keep everything steady in our tanks/aquariums, and that is more difficult the smaller the tank, but there must be an element of 'changes' in their natural habitat??? And sometimes drastic and quick??

Also as JayC states, you don't know what the highest temperature was during the period concerned? I would stick with that as the problem for now, though as James says it would be a good idea to test the ammonia/nitrite/nitrate?

Simon

 

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beanbag
20 hours ago, supermansteve32 said:

The mold was caused by some food the shrimp didn't eat.

You might have water pollution from the leftover food. 

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supermansteve32

Until recently I haven't really been feeding the shrimp much except algae wafers and sprinkle baby shrimp dust. That's was the first time I saw mold from food. 

In the past my ammonia, nitrates, nitrites have been zero but I'll measure again tomorrow. 

I also left a cooling fan while I'm away ABC's when I left the temp was 74.

Thanks everyone for your responses, in no way did any of it come across as hostile, just helpful, thanks again

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kms

may be the food you are feed have a problem, could be over feeding you shrimps, try snow flakes, they are usually eaten with in a day, so it will not polute the water.

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sdlTBfanUK

With a huge tank there will be a lot more biofilm so you probably may not even need to normally feed them until they explode in numbers of coarse.

The snowflake food is good as it doesn't foul the water, however long it is in the tank, and as before, Indian Almond leaves are a good regular and vacation food.

Always use A LOT less food than the packaging says - obviously they want you to use lots as that is business. See it more as a treat for them only!

Hope your tank has settled and no more have died since.

Simon

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CurleyJones321

I'll be honest i've just done my readings and i have increased my food dosage the last week because of my population explosion and allthough the shrimp do seem to eat it all within a day it does seem to be having an effect on my Nirtite reading so im going to ease off a bit from what i was doing to see if it solves the issue.

they say you should remove any food that isnt eaten by the shrimps after 2 hours but obviously not everyone get the luxury of working from home so its not always doable.

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kms
2 hours ago, CurleyJones321 said:

I'll be honest i've just done my readings and i have increased my food dosage the last week because of my population explosion and allthough the shrimp do seem to eat it all within a day it does seem to be having an effect on my Nirtite reading so im going to ease off a bit from what i was doing to see if it solves the issue.

they say you should remove any food that isnt eaten by the shrimps after 2 hours but obviously not everyone get the luxury of working from home so its not always doable.

Snow flakes does not need to be removed, normally I have over 30 shrimps in the tank, and with snow flake, you only need to one pellet at 1 cm in the tank for every 20 shrimps, I only put about a half, if they finish and need more food, there are plenty biofilm and algae, you cannot over or under feed shrimp if you follow the rules.

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supermansteve32

I have heard this rule of removing the food. Up until this point they've eaten everything I've put in there. The snow flakes and algae wafers they eat completely. I recently bought a 5 pack sampler of food made by shrimp king but the shrimp only fully eat the snow flakes. 

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sdlTBfanUK

I use that shrimp king mix as well, though I smash it all up and mix it together. I don't know how long some of those pellets would take to soften enough for the shrimps to be able to eat it, they are pretty compressed as even with a hammer it is quite difficult to break them up?

I have never removed any food as it usually gets spread throughout the tank anyway but as I feed very sparingly ie 1 shrimp lolly in the tank with over a hundred shrimps (1 lolly recommended for 30 shrimps) it hasn't caused me any problems over the years? I have a few assassin snails in the tanks as well.

I guess you just need to remember the tank is growing its own food all the time and so the larger the tank the more food is already available to the shrimps naturally! Depending on how many shrimps there are in your 60 gallon tank there will be a lot of biofilm.

Simon

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Liam

Do you have photos of your handsome? I want to see them.

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sdlTBfanUK

If you click on the gallery tab and scroll down a bit to sldTBfanUK pictures thats assuming the request is about my shrimps of coarse, as this isn't my thread!

Simon

Edited by sdlTBfanUK
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kms
7 hours ago, supermansteve32 said:

I have heard this rule of removing the food. Up until this point they've eaten everything I've put in there. The snow flakes and algae wafers they eat completely. I recently bought a 5 pack sampler of food made by shrimp king but the shrimp only fully eat the snow flakes. 

sdiTBfanUK introduce me to shrimp king, I also got the mixed package, and two snow flake tubs, out of all the mixes, the snow flakes is the one it eats the most, and does get eaten until they are gone.

there is one it does not eat, but since I mixed them together, I don't know the which shrimp king it is.

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supermansteve32

Hello to all. I've tested my water. Zero ammonia nitrate and nitrite.  The fan worked in keeping the temp down while I wasn't home (but there's a lot more evaporation). I may invest in a cooling system. 

I do realize there's bio film the shrimp can eat, which that's all i feed them for years because their population was so low. (That and Indian almond leaves, and the bark). But in Feb I had over 50 shrimp and now I can only count about 30. Over only witnessed about 5 dead adolescents, I guess the rest got eaten and then decayed. 

My TDS is now 127. I would've thought with evaporation it would increased the TDS.

I have another adolescent dead I just saw. The only ones alive are the grown ones, one is pregnant now. 

It seems they never eat the almond leaves or bark anymore. Do they go old after a while? 

I have one micro bubbler, do they need more o2? 

Thanks everyone, I feel like I'm over reacting but they shouldn't be dying

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jayc
6 hours ago, supermansteve32 said:

My TDS is now 127. I would've thought with evaporation it would increased the TDS.

It should raise TDS

Is yours going down???!

 

6 hours ago, supermansteve32 said:

It seems they never eat the almond leaves or bark anymore. Do they go old after a while? 

you don't need to worry about taking it out, if that is what you mean. 

 

6 hours ago, supermansteve32 said:

I have one micro bubbler, do they need more o2? 

Maybe, is there a lot of surface agitation with that one bubbler?

If it's hot, more surface agitation is a good idea, since there is less dissolved oxygen in the water at higher temps.

If shrimps are dying, check the temperature of the water. 

Edited by jayc
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