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Zoidburg

If you have 10 gallons of water with 5 GH and it evaporates down to 5 gallons of water, then the GH would be at 10.

If you add 5 more gallons of RO water or distilled to the tank, bringing it back up to 10 gallons, then the GH would be back at 5.


Theoretically speaking, assuming nothing in the tank is consuming the GH.

 

So if you want the correct GH in the tank, you need to do water changes with the correct GH or lower than what's in the tank. Some ideas on how that can be achieved.

1.) Remove shrimp from tank. Do 100% water change and add in water to the correct GH/KH/TDS values. Drip acclimate (airline hose & airline control valve) the shrimp back into the tank.

2.) If you have a GH of 8 but want a GH of 5, then pre-mix your water to 5 GH and drip acclimate the water back in. If you want to take the slow and easy path, then do 5-10% water changes every 2-3 days.

2.5) Same idea as #2, but use 2-3 GH water for water changes.

3.) In-between Option #1 and Option #2 - If you have GH that's too high, you could use pure RO water for your water changes so that way you get the GH lower, faster, but not as fast if you had done a complete water change. Again, you could do smaller but more frequent water changes until the GH is where you want it to be for the shrimp you are keeping.

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jayc
15 minutes ago, Zoidburg said:

If you have 10 gallons of water with 5 GH and it evaporates down to 5 gallons of water, then the GH would be at 10.

If you add 5 more gallons of RO water or distilled to the tank, bringing it back up to 10 gallons, then the GH would be back at 5.

I was about to say the same thing as Zoidburg.

Top ups, ie. topping up evaporated water does not reduce GH. Water evaporates and leaves behind all the salts and minerals. That's why you see GH climbing slowly over time. Assuming nothing is added and all things equal.

Water changes are essential to remove these excess waste and minerals. 

Jojo, you mentioned that you are too scared to do big water changes. Sometimes you just have to. The tank can be depleted of one or another mineral the older it gets. A big water change can reset the tank back to the right levels. As long as you match the ideal parameters for your shrimp and drip the new pre-adjusted water slowly back, the shrimps will be fine. 

It doesn't have to be 100% water change as well, that means every single drop of water is replaced. I usually change whatever amount of water where it still leaves enough water that the filter pump is still able to maintain operation, as I don't want the filter to run dry.  That could be 80% maybe.

 

Edited by jayc
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jojowhisky
If you have 10 gallons of water with 5 GH and it evaporates down to 5 gallons of water, then the GH would be at 10.
If you add 5 more gallons of RO water or distilled to the tank, bringing it back up to 10 gallons, then the GH would be back at 5.

Theoretically speaking, assuming nothing in the tank is consuming the GH.
 
So if you want the correct GH in the tank, you need to do water changes with the correct GH or lower than what's in the tank. Some ideas on how that can be achieved.

1.) Remove shrimp from tank. Do 100% water change and add in water to the correct GH/KH/TDS values. Drip acclimate (airline hose & airline control valve) the shrimp back into the tank.

2.) If you have a GH of 8 but want a GH of 5, then pre-mix your water to 5 GH and drip acclimate the water back in. If you want to take the slow and easy path, then do 5-10% water changes every 2-3 days.
2.5) Same idea as #2, but use 2-3 GH water for water changes.
3.) In-between Option #1 and Option #2 - If you have GH that's too high, you could use pure RO water for your water changes so that way you get the GH lower, faster, but not as fast if you had done a complete water change. Again, you could do smaller but more frequent water changes until the GH is where you want it to be for the shrimp you are keeping.
Got it.
I am schooled again.
Will apply this theory together with simon's guidelines.
This really explains adjusting water parameters with water changes in detail. Thank you for going into the minute details.
Deeply appreciated.

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 Jojo, you mentioned that you are too scared to do big water changes. Sometimes you just have to. The tank can be depleted of one or another mineral the older it gets. A big water change can reset the tank back to the right levels. As long as you match the ideal parameters for your shrimp and drip the new pre-adjusted water slowly back, the shrimps will be fine. 
It doesn't have to be 100% water change as well, that means every single drop of water is replaced. I usually change whatever amount of water where it still leaves enough water that the filter pump is still able to maintain operation, as I don't want the filter to run dry.  That could be 80% maybe.
 


Yep, i will be brave and do it.
I think dripping the adjusted water in slowly, will surely not kill the shrimps.
In theory, better to correct the bad conditions than to let it sit in the tank and kill everyone.
Thanks again.

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sdlTBfanUK

You may be ok with the distilled water long term if it suits you better, you could try it for a while before buying the zerowater. Probably worth testing the GH and KH of the distilled water once just so you know that also fits in. As JayC points out (to both of us) you shouldn't need to use dechlorinator, but I understand your reluctance to chance it, I am planning to try not using it this week, but when it comes to it who knows whether I will be brave enough????

Incidently, your tank holds 14 Litres of water based on the TDS figures you gave, so my guess was spot on! Does your tank have a cover as that should slow down evaporation (and resultant TDS swinging)?

You MUST top up with just the distilled water always. The water that has evaporated has left the TDS in the tank (ie the evaporated water TDS was 000, so the TDS in the tank will have risen, then when you top up with new water (if it is TDS 000) the figure then will return to what it was before the evaporation. If you top up with water of TDS 011, then it will actually rise 1 TDS after topped up 1 litre of that water, which is small enough not to really matter as can be corrected when you next do your water change etc, and probably 1 litre may be a weeks worth of topping up anyway? If you were expecting the TDS to drop with topping up with the distilled (or even RO/Zerowater for that matter) as I think you were saying (?), it doesn't work that way - took me a while to get my head around how that works................ To slow down the speed of dropping the TDS from the 26 this time (probably a bit drastic for shrimp) it may be better to add some of the GH+ to the NEW water each time and get the new water TDS to say 100 for the new water as that will be less of a drop and you also know that some goodness is going into the tank? A female friend explained it to me thus, so this may make it clearer:

It is like making gravy in a saucepan, the water that evaporates, and is on the lid of the saucepan is pure water (clear) and the gravy still has all the gravy in it so it gets thicker (darker), when  you add more water to the level it was at the start, it dilutes it back to the same consistency/colour as when you started, and you can do this all day long and it won't change colour/consistency/taste. Don't know if I am getting this over correctly but it made sense to me???????????

We had a hot summer and my shrimp survived unaffected at 26 degrees (water temperature) but 30 degrees (water temperature) has killed my shrimp in the past.I Keep a link to that video and watch it every so often as it covers virtually ALL the basics.

I had a few other thoughts on how I did my 15 Litres that I think helped:

I only cleaned the glass of the front of the tank to give the shrimps as much biofilm as possible. I also do this still with the bigger tank and it is the best way to see the babies, they graze on it. Depends on your liking etc to a degree, but generally the less you clean the sides/back may be better, ie if you can only see the front of the tank as the tank is slotted between things then best to just clean the front etc, if that makes sense?

I don't know if you have any moss but the babies seemed to appreciate that, either a small moss pad or two, and/or moss ball or two. I had 2 of each in my 15L.

Simon

 

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sdlTBfanUK
9 hours ago, jayc said:

I was about to say the same thing as Zoidburg.

Top ups, ie. topping up evaporated water does not reduce GH. Water evaporates and leaves behind all the salts and minerals. That's why you see GH climbing slowly over time. Assuming nothing is added and all things equal.

Water changes are essential to remove these excess waste and minerals. 

Jojo, you mentioned that you are too scared to do big water changes. Sometimes you just have to. The tank can be depleted of one or another mineral the older it gets. A big water change can reset the tank back to the right levels. As long as you match the ideal parameters for your shrimp and drip the new pre-adjusted water slowly back, the shrimps will be fine. 

It doesn't have to be 100% water change as well, that means every single drop of water is replaced. I usually change whatever amount of water where it still leaves enough water that the filter pump is still able to maintain operation, as I don't want the filter to run dry.  That could be 80% maybe.

 

Sorry, I read this after I replied, I should read backward in future......

Simon

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jojowhisky
You may be ok with the distilled water long term if it suits you better, you could try it for a while before buying the zerowater. Probably worth testing the GH and KH of the distilled water once just so you know that also fits in. As JayC points out (to both of us) you shouldn't need to use dechlorinator, but I understand your reluctance to chance it, I am planning to try not using it this week, but when it comes to it who knows whether I will be brave enough????
Incidently, your tank holds 14 Litres of water based on the TDS figures you gave, so my guess was spot on! Does your tank have a cover as that should slow down evaporation (and resultant TDS swinging)?
You MUST top up with just the distilled water always. The water that has evaporated has left the TDS in the tank (ie the evaporated water TDS was 000, so the TDS in the tank will have risen, then when you top up with new water (if it is TDS 000) the figure then will return to what it was before the evaporation. If you top up with water of TDS 011, then it will actually rise 1 TDS after topped up 1 litre of that water, which is small enough not to really matter as can be corrected when you next do your water change etc, and probably 1 litre may be a weeks worth of topping up anyway? If you were expecting the TDS to drop with topping up with the distilled (or even RO/Zerowater for that matter) as I think you were saying (?), it doesn't work that way - took me a while to get my head around how that works................ To slow down the speed of dropping the TDS from the 26 this time (probably a bit drastic for shrimp) it may be better to add some of the GH+ to the NEW water each time and get the new water TDS to say 100 for the new water as that will be less of a drop and you also know that some goodness is going into the tank? A female friend explained it to me thus, so this may make it clearer:
It is like making gravy in a saucepan, the water that evaporates, and is on the lid of the saucepan is pure water (clear) and the gravy still has all the gravy in it so it gets thicker (darker), when  you add more water to the level it was at the start, it dilutes it back to the same consistency/colour as when you started, and you can do this all day long and it won't change colour/consistency/taste. Don't know if I am getting this over correctly but it made sense to me???????????
We had a hot summer and my shrimp survived unaffected at 26 degrees (water temperature) but 30 degrees (water temperature) has killed my shrimp in the past.I Keep a link to that video and watch it every so often as it covers virtually ALL the basics.
I had a few other thoughts on how I did my 15 Litres that I think helped:
I only cleaned the glass of the front of the tank to give the shrimps as much biofilm as possible. I also do this still with the bigger tank and it is the best way to see the babies, they graze on it. Depends on your liking etc to a degree, but generally the less you clean the sides/back may be better, ie if you can only see the front of the tank as the tank is slotted between things then best to just clean the front etc, if that makes sense?
I don't know if you have any moss but the babies seemed to appreciate that, either a small moss pad or two, and/or moss ball or two. I had 2 of each in my 15L.
Simon
 
Hey simon,
Yep correct i had thought that through evaporation, the tds will drop than with a top up it may drop further due to dilution.
(Just thoughts that i had,sounds stupid but i just had to ask). Thank you for the gravy analogy, i understand what zoidburg, jayc and urself are explaining even more clearly now.
Nothing can beat a water change and like what jayc said, if its bad, sometimes you just need to go and do that big water change.
Solid salts can only be greatly reduced by the water change there is no other way i guess.
This thread really addressed my questions on water changes and parameters.
I feel that after mastering to maintain the paraneters that works for your shrimp, next would be to tether and plan water changes. I will not be able to figure anything out had no one replied to this thread, one cannot plan a schedule of water changes if one does not understand the physics behind parameters.
Things havent gotten horribly wrong yet, will monitor the conditions. Keeping to 1litre water changes weekly. But now that i am more educated on how all of this works, the min things change, i am prepared to do that big water change.
Ps: yep you were quite spot on my tank capacity!
I have a next very impt question. Will start a new thread. Kind of like a btb(back to basics)
I only have this tank and i had thought that tetras could be kept together with the shrimps, thank heavens i removed them before the babies hatched. Anyways this tank was cycled in a way that was the best i understood how(did not find this helpful forum here than), it was so rushed!
My question would be how to properly cycle a tank, shrimp specific tank. (The long fishless cycle, i rather wait)I do not see good articles online.
Thanks again everyone.
Hope everyone had a great monday.

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jojowhisky

"I only cleaned the glass of the front of the tank to give the shrimps as much biofilm as possible. I also do this still with the bigger tank and it is the best way to see the babies, they graze on it. Depends on your liking etc to a degree, but generally the less you clean the sides/back may be better, ie if you can only see the front of the tank as the tank is slotted between things then best to just clean the front etc, if that makes sense?
I don't know if you have any moss but the babies seemed to appreciate that, either a small moss pad or two, and/or moss ball or two. I had 2 of each in my 15L."

~Ahhhh i do not have the habit of scrubbing off the walls of the tank. I think that the babies would appreciate the biofilm on there.
If i can recall, think i only scrubbed it once the 3rd week into starting the tank, the algae was bad, couldnt see into the tank much, did not get any snails as well so i actually scrubbed off some of the algae.
Unless its blocking my viewing than i would scrub it off. Algae also lends the scape an aged look. Doesnt look forced asthetically.
The tetras in the picture was before i moved them.

e044e6a26eaa17323ed261f3169d88f9.jpgc9b8c19aa3d0760c56889e0e369e6923.jpg5b701f20993f67f856ce75ae89b42e7c.jpg25ccfee4f2d6af5d111a3c42c117ab9d.jpg8e027656ee00361c81d0a024626c1d1d.jpg

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sdlTBfanUK
8 minutes ago, jojowhisky said:

Hey simon,
Yep correct i had thought that through evaporation, the tds will drop than with a top up it may drop further due to dilution.
(Just thoughts that i had,sounds stupid but i just had to ask). Thank you for the gravy analogy, i understand what zoidburg, jayc and urself are explaining even more clearly now.
Nothing can beat a water change and like what jayc said, if its bad, sometimes you just need to go and do that big water change.
Solid salts can only be greatly reduced by the water change there is no other way i guess.
This thread really addressed my questions on water changes and parameters.
I feel that after mastering to maintain the paraneters that works for your shrimp, next would be to tether and plan water changes. I will not be able to figure anything out had no one replied to this thread, one cannot plan a schedule of water changes if one does not understand the physics behind parameters.
Things havent gotten horribly wrong yet, will monitor the conditions. Keeping to 1litre water changes weekly. But now that i am more educated on how all of this works, the min things change, i am prepared to do that big water change.
Ps: yep you were quite spot on my tank capacity!
I have a next very impt question. Will start a new thread. Kind of like a btb(back to basics)
I only have this tank and i had thought that tetras could be kept together with the shrimps, thank heavens i removed them before the babies hatched. Anyways this tank was cycled in a way that was the best i understood how(did not find this helpful forum here than), it was so rushed!
My question would be how to properly cycle a tank, shrimp specific tank. (The long fishless cycle, i rather wait)I do not see good articles online.
Thanks again everyone. emoji178.png
Hope everyone had a great monday.

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
 

I have tetras in with my cherry shrimp, as per that video I am sure the fish will/do eat any babies they can find. Having said that I have given babies to a friend with a huge tank and they breed and he always says he has lots so some must survive. At then end of the day it is nature so I imagine shrimp know to hide, but that is harder in a small tank. I wouldn't risk my beautiful Taiwan bees with fish though!!!

You shouldn't need to recycle the tank if you are just changing the water, as far as I know anyway, or are you talking another tank? I have this short cut to the one I used if it is a help. There probably are threads on this website somewhere! I probably made some points in the thread on Tapwater I did so I will leave your new thread to others who understand that better than I.

http://www.tropical-fish-success.com/cycling-an-aquarium.html

As stated  before, I did 1 Litre weekly water changes when up and running (mainly to rinse the dirty sponge in) in the 15L I had and that worked well (about 8% per week water change). You may want to do slightly bigger changes whilst trying to adjust the parameters as it will speed it up a bit, even if it is 1.5Litres if you don't want to go up to 2L change. Zoidburg made the point not to just use plain water so I would make it as near 100TDS so you are adding some good stuff and making the adjustment slower!

I have made my water for this week and as per JayC I haven't used dechlorinator.

I agree with you that as nothing has gone too badly wrong  I would personally try the 'gradual' change route first, rather than the more drastic 'reset/restart' route which would be wise if you were having bigger problems (losing lots of shrimp), hopefully that won't happen in the interim?

Simon

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sdlTBfanUK
37 minutes ago, jojowhisky said:

"I only cleaned the glass of the front of the tank to give the shrimps as much biofilm as possible. I also do this still with the bigger tank and it is the best way to see the babies, they graze on it. Depends on your liking etc to a degree, but generally the less you clean the sides/back may be better, ie if you can only see the front of the tank as the tank is slotted between things then best to just clean the front etc, if that makes sense?
I don't know if you have any moss but the babies seemed to appreciate that, either a small moss pad or two, and/or moss ball or two. I had 2 of each in my 15L."

~Ahhhh i do not have the habit of scrubbing off the walls of the tank. I think that the babies would appreciate the biofilm on there.
If i can recall, think i only scrubbed it once the 3rd week into starting the tank, the algae was bad, couldnt see into the tank much, did not get any snails as well so i actually scrubbed off some of the algae.
Unless its blocking my viewing than i would scrub it off. Algae also lends the scape an aged look. Doesnt look forced asthetically.
The tetras in the picture was before i moved them.

e044e6a26eaa17323ed261f3169d88f9.jpgc9b8c19aa3d0760c56889e0e369e6923.jpg5b701f20993f67f856ce75ae89b42e7c.jpg25ccfee4f2d6af5d111a3c42c117ab9d.jpg8e027656ee00361c81d0a024626c1d1d.jpg

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Lovely pretty tank, we have crossed posted......

The cherry shrimp may even adapt to the new water as they are hardier than the caridinia. I see you have some moss, moss ball and plenty of soil.

I think you have the same filter as I use (I have 2 per 30L tank). If they are the same, I permanently remove the bottom plates, this means there is more sponge area for the shrimps to graze on and more filter area as well , and when you want to wash the sponge you just turn the filter 120 degrees (anticlockwise in your case and still attached to the glass) pull out the sponge, rinse it, and reverse, takes less than a minute - you don't even need to turn it off or take anything apart as the top end stays under water etc. Sponge needs to be tightly fitting in place so no shrimp can get inside and the sponge doesn't just drop out of coarse. Your glass though may not be deep enough for you to turn it through 120 degrees?

Simon

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jayc
7 hours ago, sdlTBfanUK said:

I have made my water for this week and as per JayC I haven't used dechlorinator.

That's a positive step forward. Appreciate you taking my advise. I know it is not always comfortable. I have been there too with this hobby. And if it wasn't for lots of willingness to change and experiments, we would never progress.

 

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sdlTBfanUK
10 hours ago, jayc said:

That's a positive step forward. Appreciate you taking my advise. I know it is not always comfortable. I have been there too with this hobby. And if it wasn't for lots of willingness to change and experiments, we would never progress.

 

I appreciate the advice and bow to your greater experience and what you said made complete sense. The Zerowater website said it removes chlorine but I was just a bit reluctant to risk it as everything is going so well. Thanks for your interest/concern.

Simon

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sdlTBfanUK
19 hours ago, sdlTBfanUK said:

Lovely pretty tank, we have crossed posted......

The cherry shrimp may even adapt to the new water as they are hardier than the caridinia. I see you have some moss, moss ball and plenty of soil.

I think you have the same filter as I use (I have 2 per 30L tank). If they are the same, I permanently remove the bottom plates, this means there is more sponge area for the shrimps to graze on and more filter area as well , and when you want to wash the sponge you just turn the filter 120 degrees (anticlockwise in your case and still attached to the glass) pull out the sponge, rinse it, and reverse, takes less than a minute - you don't even need to turn it off or take anything apart as the top end stays under water etc. Sponge needs to be tightly fitting in place so no shrimp can get inside and the sponge doesn't just drop out of coarse. Your glass though may not be deep enough for you to turn it through 120 degrees?

Simon

Not sure if attaching this will even work but it is a spreadsheet so you can work out what your new TDS will be in your tank by just completing the 4 blue figures. I have done it as for your tank with 14 litres of water. It is pretty basic so I am a little hesitant to attach it as I don't want anyone to be insulted in any way, the thing is it works and I have passed it to friends in the past and they seemed to appreciate it?

It will only be accurate if you take out as much water as you put back in!

Better go do the weekly shrimp tank now I guess.

 

TDS Calculator.xlsx

Edited by sdlTBfanUK

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jojowhisky
I have tetras in with my cherry shrimp, as per that video I am sure the fish will/do eat any babies they can find. Having said that I have given babies to a friend with a huge tank and they breed and he always says he has lots so some must survive. At then end of the day it is nature so I imagine shrimp know to hide, but that is harder in a small tank. I wouldn't risk my beautiful Taiwan bees with fish though!!!
You shouldn't need to recycle the tank if you are just changing the water, as far as I know anyway, or are you talking another tank? I have this short cut to the one I used if it is a help. There probably are threads on this website somewhere! I probably made some points in the thread on Tapwater I did so I will leave your new thread to others who understand that better than I.
http://www.tropical-fish-success.com/cycling-an-aquarium.html
As stated  before, I did 1 Litre weekly water changes when up and running (mainly to rinse the dirty sponge in) in the 15L I had and that worked well (about 8% per week water change). You may want to do slightly bigger changes whilst trying to adjust the parameters as it will speed it up a bit, even if it is 1.5Litres if you don't want to go up to 2L change. Zoidburg made the point not to just use plain water so I would make it as near 100TDS so you are adding some good stuff and making the adjustment slower!
I have made my water for this week and as per JayC I haven't used dechlorinator.
I agree with you that as nothing has gone too badly wrong  I would personally try the 'gradual' change route first, rather than the more drastic 'reset/restart' route which would be wise if you were having bigger problems (losing lots of shrimp), hopefully that won't happen in the interim?
Simon
Yep, i am gonna start 2 new tanks.
One for the tetras and one for some tangerine looking shrimp(dont really know the breed), those were bought for me by my sister. She had thought i could just throw them in with the crystals and reds
They had been in a large pail since before i started my tank!! No deaths?! And because one was already berried when my sister bought her, that shrimp laid all her eggs in the fish bag before my sister could even pass them to me!! Got 3 of them in there and couple of babies.
That pail needs work, tds is (wait for it, please dont faint...340!!!)
I will be doing a wc later, i do one every week but the tds is over the roof. The rest of the parameters are:
Kh 3
Gh 7
Ph 6.2 ( bare bottom pail no active substrate)
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 25



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jojowhisky
Lovely pretty tank, we have crossed posted......
The cherry shrimp may even adapt to the new water as they are hardier than the caridinia. I see you have some moss, moss ball and plenty of soil.
I think you have the same filter as I use (I have 2 per 30L tank). If they are the same, I permanently remove the bottom plates, this means there is more sponge area for the shrimps to graze on and more filter area as well , and when you want to wash the sponge you just turn the filter 120 degrees (anticlockwise in your case and still attached to the glass) pull out the sponge, rinse it, and reverse, takes less than a minute - you don't even need to turn it off or take anything apart as the top end stays under water etc. Sponge needs to be tightly fitting in place so no shrimp can get inside and the sponge doesn't just drop out of coarse. Your glass though may not be deep enough for you to turn it through 120 degrees?
Simon
Thanks for the idea didnt think about removing the bottom plate. Im sure the babies would love the extra grazing.
My filter is now looking abit silly, i put a panty hose over the entire intake portion. Everyone post videos on baby proofing hob filters but i dont see one on internal filters. So before mummy laid all her babies, i put that pantyhose over the intake portion. The outflow on this filter is rather strong so i assumed the intake strength is gonna be too strong for the babies.
Yeah, cant turn the filter media portion out, i will have to take the whole filter out of the water for maintainence.(again, that too huge bonsai tree) i agree had i not put the huge tree there, i could just twist that portion off. Terribly messy but its due to my bad decision of not taking the tank size before planning the scape for it.

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jojowhisky

Thanks for the spreadsheet!
Will have a look at it later, basic but im sure it will help! I am anyway learning the basics now. Thank you for all the advice. I will look at it later!
I have also done a water top up today and have refrained from adding prime, i reached out for it but remembered jayc's advice.
Heres to much learning in this hobby!

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sdlTBfanUK
1 hour ago, jojowhisky said:

Yep, i am gonna start 2 new tanks.
One for the tetras and one for some tangerine looking shrimp(dont really know the breed), those were bought for me by my sister. She had thought i could just throw them in with the crystals and redsemoji58.png
They had been in a large pail since before i started my tank!! No deaths?! And because one was already berried when my sister bought her, that shrimp laid all her eggs in the fish bag before my sister could even pass them to me!! Got 3 of them in there and couple of babies.
That pail needs work, tds is (wait for it, please dont faint...340!!!)
I will be doing a wc later, i do one every week but the tds is over the roof. The rest of the parameters are:
Kh 3
Gh 7
Ph 6.2 ( bare bottom pail no active substrate)
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 25



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If you use dechlorinated tap water TDS121, GH3 and do a 50% water change in the pail it should take the parameters to GH5 and TDS 230. IF the shrimp are tangerine Tigers these parameters (as per the video) are pretty much there. A friend has Tangerine tigers and says they are hardier than Taiwan Bee and nearly as easy as cherrys, IF THAT IS WHAT THEY ARE?? You could try typing 'Tangerine Tiger Shrimp' in google and looking at images to see if it looks like the pictures. Difficult to know the parameters without knowing what type they are?

IF they are Tangerine tigers you may be able to get away with just using dechlorinated tap water (with maybe some GH+ to increase the tds/GH if the tank runs at the Tap water TDS121 and GH3, but that would need reassessing when it is up and running, especially if the pail water came from the tap as well?). I would probably wash/squeeze the sponge from your old tank into the new tank to seed it and I did put a neon in the tank and it survived to go back in the fish tank later - I didn't think it would survive.

You are certainly going to have fun keeping track of different tank parameters with each tank

I HOPE I AM KEEPING UP WITH EVERYTHING????????

Simon

Edited by sdlTBfanUK
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sdlTBfanUK
1 hour ago, jojowhisky said:

Thanks for the idea didnt think about removing the bottom plate. Im sure the babies would love the extra grazing.
My filter is now looking abit silly, i put a panty hose over the entire intake portion. Everyone post videos on baby proofing hob filters but i dont see one on internal filters. So before mummy laid all her babies, i put that pantyhose over the intake portion. The outflow on this filter is rather strong so i assumed the intake strength is gonna be too strong for the babies.
Yeah, cant turn the filter media portion out, i will have to take the whole filter out of the water for maintainence.emoji58.png(again, that too huge bonsai tree) i agree had i not put the huge tree there, i could just twist that portion off. Terribly messy but its due to my bad decision of not taking the tank size before planning the scape for it.emoji2368.png

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I assume you/we are talking about the tank in the pictures above and not one in a different tank or the pail? If so it doesn't need covering with pantyhose as the shrimp can't get through the sponge, even without the base plate fitted. If you leave that base off you may have to remove the whole filter (as you would have too anyway) but you won't need to do anything further than remove the sponge from the open bottom, wash it and return it through the open bottom, whereas before you probably had to break it open to get the sponge out.

Hope this makes sense?

Simon

I don't think you have made any mistakes with the tank, I wish mine looked as nice?

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jojowhisky
If you use dechlorinated tap water TDS121, GH3 and do a 50% water change in the pail it should take the parameters to GH5 and TDS 230. IF the shrimp are tangerine Tigers these parameters (as per the video) are pretty much there. A friend has Tangerine tigers and says they are hardier than Taiwan Bee and nearly as easy as cherrys, IF THAT IS WHAT THEY ARE?? You could try typing 'Tangerine Tiger Shrimp' in google and looking at images to see if it looks like the pictures. Difficult to know the parameters without knowing what type they are?
IF they are Tangerine tigers you may be able to get away with just using dechlorinated tap water (with maybe some GH+ to increase the tds/GH if the tank runs at the Tap water TDS121 and GH3, but that would need reassessing when it is up and running, especially if the pail water came from the tap as well?). I would probably wash/squeeze the sponge from your old tank into the new tank to seed it and I did put a neon in the tank and it survived to go back in the fish tank later - I didn't think it would survive.
You are certainly going to have fun keeping track of different tank parameters with each tank
I HOPE I AM KEEPING UP WITH EVERYTHING????????
Simon
Sounds like a plan..lets do tds 230 and gh 5. Will slowly drip that into the pail.
They have orange to yellow shells. Hmmm not helping right? I could be colour blind or they are low grade tangerine tigers
Yep i was reading your thread on keeping a betta earlier in the day. Jayc n urself mentioned washing off the dirty filter in the new tank. Awesome idea to port the bacteria colony over.
I am suffering from MTS (multi tank syndrome) and i know i will continue asking myself why why why do i create more issues when i am already an over thinker
Photo id below: sorry for the bad mugshots, very difficult to get a picture down at the tank7f126b37ee2e7e704819853e648a085c.jpg25cbe1b5d1ff2e2f9eec0b219a97f75c.jpg

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jojowhisky
I assume you/we are talking about the tank in the pictures above and not one in a different tank or the pail? If so it doesn't need covering with pantyhose as the shrimp can't get through the sponge, even without the base plate fitted. If you leave that base off you may have to remove the whole filter (as you would have too anyway) but you won't need to do anything further than remove the sponge from the open bottom, wash it and return it through the open bottom, whereas before you probably had to break it open to get the sponge out.
Hope this makes sense?
Simon
I don't think you have made any mistakes with the tank, I wish mine looked as nice?
Yep we talking about the same tank.
Well this is where i am an over thinker, been reading all the articles saying how babies can sucked into the filter. Have never in my life seen a baby shrimp so could only imagine how small they were to be sucked in like what others have experienced. Explains the panty hose....
If i could do over this tank, that "diftwood shaped into a bonsai tree" would be seriously downsized, i had big visions but forgot how small the tank is, well, this is my first tank.
My hands are very small but i cant even get into the sides n corners to gravel vac, so i just left it. Very cramped.

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Better photo i hope, dont know what are they but man, they are HARDY!bf642b1ea8d15fb6358c29032d38b3dd.jpg

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sdlTBfanUK
42 minutes ago, jojowhisky said:

Sounds like a plan..lets do tds 230 and gh 5. Will slowly drip that into the pail.
They have orange to yellow shells. Hmmm not helping right? I could be colour blind or they are low grade tangerine tigers emoji2960.png
Yep i was reading your thread on keeping a betta earlier in the day. Jayc n urself mentioned washing off the dirty filter in the new tank. Awesome idea to port the bacteria colony over.
I am suffering from MTS (multi tank syndrome) and i know i will continue asking myself why why why do i create more issues when i am already an over thinker emoji58.png
Photo id below: sorry for the bad mugshots, very difficult to get a picture down at the tank7f126b37ee2e7e704819853e648a085c.jpg25cbe1b5d1ff2e2f9eec0b219a97f75c.jpg

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I can't really tell whether they are Tangerine Tiger or plain orange cherry, they both have similar enough parameters and are adaptable enough that it probably doesn't matter too much. Usually the Tangerine tigers have black spots on the side.

Sponge filters are shrimp safe so the one in the bucket is also fine.

Just to clarify, remove half of the old water, then drip that same amount of (dechlorinated) tap water at GH3 TDS121 into the tank, then the water in the bucket will end up at TDS230 GH5 when you have finished. Thinking about it those final figures nay change VERY slightly as have not allowed for the very small TDS of the dechlorinator?

It is easy to get carried away. My filter in the shrimp tank started spraying water out of the tank (very slowly), luckily the tank is on a sheet of plastic and a towel which saved the unit it is on, but that persuaded me not to risk another tank with the betta!

Simon

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jojowhisky
I can't really tell whether they are Tangerine Tiger or plain orange cherry, they both have similar enough parameters and are adaptable enough that it probably doesn't matter too much. Usually the Tangerine tigers have black spots on the side.
Sponge filters are shrimp safe so the one in the bucket is also fine.
Just to clarify, remove half of the old water, then drip that same amount of (dechlorinated) tap water at GH3 TDS121 into the tank, then the water in the bucket will end up at TDS230 GH5 when you have finished. Thinking about it those final figures nay change VERY slightly as have not allowed for the very small TDS of the dechlorinator?
It is easy to get carried away. My filter in the shrimp tank started spraying water out of the tank (very slowly), luckily the tank is on a sheet of plastic and a towel which saved the unit it is on, but that persuaded me not to risk another tank with the betta!
Simon
Yep ok got it. Thank you for being crystal clear on the plan.
Nope they dont seem to have black spots on the side, if anything one of them got only a very faint hint of orange/yellow colour on its top, the rest of its body is colourless?

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sdlTBfanUK
1 hour ago, jojowhisky said:

Yep we talking about the same tank.
Well this is where i am an over thinker, been reading all the articles saying how babies can sucked into the filter. Have never in my life seen a baby shrimp so could only imagine how small they were to be sucked in like what others have experienced. Explains the panty hose....
If i could do over this tank, that "diftwood shaped into a bonsai tree" would be seriously downsized, i had big visions but forgot how small the tank is, well, this is my first tank.
My hands are very small but i cant even get into the sides n corners to gravel vac, so i just left it. Very cramped.emoji1785.png

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Better photo i hope, dont know what are they but man, they are HARDY!bf642b1ea8d15fb6358c29032d38b3dd.jpg

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Ok, this may get a lot of contradictory posts, but I have soil base as you do in your tank with the red cherrys/crystals and (on advise from my supplier it has to be stated) I never gravel vac, never have as it isn't gravel, but soil. Anyway it is too crowded with plants to be able to do it. Between the plants and snails in the tank even my 5 year old tank with the fish has never had a problem and to my simple brain the poo is just like fertiliser for the plants and food for the snails.

I'd wait and see if there is a lot of contradicting replies to this though as this isn't something I know about just from my personal experience (and when I asked about buying a vac my supplier said I don't need to bother with the soil?).

As there is no soil in the bucket it would be wise to vac the bottom though!

Babies are virtually unseeable when first born, 1mm and usually clear, but they grow quickly enough!

Simon

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jojowhisky
Ok, this may get a lot of contradictory posts, but I have soil base as you do in your tank with the red cherrys/crystals and (on advise from my supplier it has to be stated) I never gravel vac, never have as it isn't gravel, but soil. Anyway it is too crowded with plants to be able to do it. Between the plants and snails in the tank even my 5 year old tank with the fish has never had a problem and to my simple brain the poo is just like fertiliser for the plants and food for the snails.
I'd wait and see if there is a lot of contradicting replies to this though as this isn't something I know about just from my personal experience (and when I asked about buying a vac my supplier said I don't need to bother with the soil?).
Simon
Yep i read an article after a very frustrating attempt to gravel vac that tank, it said that actually for a planted tank, you gravel vac only on the bare areas and that is if you are a serial over feeder, carpet areas, you just need to swirl the gravel vac on top and collect the debris that fly out. The consequence of carpet plants is that you are gonna get detritus stuck underneath but i guess it is fertilizer for them.
Please correct me if im wrong on the above point, just quoting what i read in one article.
I guess strictly use a feeding dish.
I just go over areas with visible debris with a "turkey baster"?(is that what its called?) Here in sg we just call it the sucker hahahaha


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sdlTBfanUK
4 minutes ago, jojowhisky said:

Yep i read an article after a very frustrating attempt to gravel vac that tank, it said that actually for a planted tank, you gravel vac only on the bare areas and that is if you are a serial over feeder, carpet areas, you just need to swirl the gravel vac on top and collect the debris that fly out. The consequence of carpet plants is that you are gonna get detritus stuck underneath but i guess it is fertilizer for them.
Please correct me if im wrong on the above point, just quoting what i read in one article.
I guess strictly use a feeding dish.
I just go over areas with visible debris with a "turkey baster"?(is that what its called?) Here in sg we just call it the sucker hahahaha


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Yes it is called a turkey baster, I have one, never actually used it though for either shrimp tanks nor cooking!

Phew! hopefully then I won't get lots of chastising posts about not vac cleaning, though as I say I couldn't anyway as too well covered with plants/wood/stone etc. I wouldn't even have room for a small feeding dish?

Simon

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jojowhisky
Yes it is called a turkey baster, I have one, never actually used it though for either shrimp tanks nor cooking!
Phew! hopefully then I won't get lots of chastising posts about not vac cleaning, though as I say I couldn't anyway as too well covered with plants/wood/stone etc. I wouldn't even have room for a small feeding dish?
Simon
Yes agreed.(says all owners of small cramped tanks)
Ya i use the turkey baster to siphon like fallen moss or small plants out of the water, very useful. Sadly, dead shrimps as well.
I use a porcelain tea cup as a food dish. Not an english tea cup, chinese tea cup(very small,finish your tea in one gulp, sip it finish in 3, never finishing it because you are deep in conversation or thought or because you are sampling the aroma) because yep! No space!!5e23cb2cb07b13af26bcc24eed5e476b.jpg

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