Hamburg-Matten Filters

[Cryptocorynus]

Has anyone had any experience with Hamburg-Matten filters before? Someone I know is thinking about using these for all the tanks in a rack and I'm just wondering if this isn't as reckless as it would seem. I have heard that due to their huge surface area that they are one of the best filters ever designed (they were very popular before canister filters), but has anyone got any first-hand info on these?

Edited June 26, 2016 by Cryptocorynus

[zn30]

Thanks for introducing me to the idea. I've seen these as hang on filters which are air driven never in the tank however as hang on filters I really didn't like the concept. In the tank looks like it may be better due to the area were the mulm would collect. With shrimp it would also be a feeding area as they do on sponge filters. I would need to have a look at the sponge being 30PPI - pores per inch to see if it would be suitable for shrimplets. I might try this out myself in a smaller tank.

[jayc]

You might want to grill fishmosy about a HMF. He uses it for his zebra biotope tank.

Found the link.

 

As a filter, it is a very feasible filter type especially for shrimps, since they dont produce much waste. They space behind the sponge can be packed with bio media, so it can be very much like a canister.

The down sides are that they don't look pretty,  and they take up valuable tank space. 

[fishmosy]

Whilst that tank has been shutdown, I'm currently running two Hamburg matte filters in other shrimp tanks. I'm pretty happy with them but I like to have a second form of filtration running simultaneously, particularly as a form of mechanical filtration. 

[Cryptocorynus]

1 hour ago, jayc said:

The down sides are that they don't look pretty,  and they take up valuable tank space. 

The tanks will intentionally be very deep as to account for the filter at the back of the tank The filter should also be black to double as a background at the same time. 

 

30 minutes ago, fishmosy said:

I'm pretty happy with them but I like to have a second form of filtration running simultaneously, particularly as a form of mechanical filtration. 

The person I am talking about is thinking of doing that too. Great to hear it works well! 

Edited June 27, 2016 by Cryptocorynus

[Bill88]

I was thinking of doing his after watching joe from diy fish keepers make one. So simple too!

The negative is as jayc said that it takes up valuable space plus the need for a second mechanical filter in my opinion may be required.

@jayc do you happen to have any photos of your setup?

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Sorry I meant @ fishmosy :)

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[Cryptocorynus]

20 minutes ago, Bill88 said:

... do you happen to have any photos of your setup?

I second that. Photos would be amazing!

[fishmosy]

As requested, here are photos of one of my tanks. Excuse the image quality and the state of the tank. I've been away for a few weeks and the algae flourished. 

Tank is 1.5 foot, sitting lengthways on my rack. Second filter is a sponge filter that I used to cycle the tank. Might switch it out for a HOB to gain more space in the tank as its really overkill at this point. 

the filter is driven by a small pump and DIY plumbing and spray bar. I will be filling in more behind the main sponge with more filter media and extra sponge. I wish I had used a thicker sponge but this is the thickest Poret sponge I could get in black. The sponge is held in place by plastic channel that is siliconed to the sides and base of the tank. 

 

[Bill88]

Thanks@fishmosy ! Would the flow rate bee to strong with a hob filter and possibly injure the babies?

My initial thought was that it doesn't take up too much space tbh but I understand that it's a small tank.

How many tanks are on your rack? Im asking because I'd imagine it would start getting expensive if there are several tanks all with with hob filters.

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[Cryptocorynus]

Looks great, @fishmosy! Definitely some food for thought. 

[fishmosy]

I have a motorised HOB on another tank and the shrimp love it. However, given there is already a motorised pump in this tank (I.e. Plenty of current) I'll probably use an air driven HOB. 

There are nine tanks on the rack, ranging in size from 1.5ft to 4ft. All are filtered with a variety of methods in including canisters, air driven filters, sponge filters, HOB and of course the Hamburg-Matten. I tailor the filtration to the shrimp and other organisms that I'm keeping in that particular tank. 

Yep the hobby can get expensive but I think it is all worth it. 

[Bill88]

Building the setup is rewarding in itself!

I just reread your post where you said there is a small pump which explains the spray bar which also explains the flow rate haha. Now it makes more sense to me! Great idea!

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[NoGi]

Am I hearing something about a new DIY thread to help newbies out? 

[Kaylenna]

Is the idea of a Hamburg-Matten style filter like a super-sized, air driven version of an in-tank motorized filter with attached housing for a sponge and sometimes other porous materials?  (like http://www.thetechden.com.au/Aquael_Pat_Mini_Filter_for_tanks_10_80_liters_p/111605.htm).

Why do you guys think you need a second mechanical filter?  (for those of you that stated this)  I'd be tempted to try this... but only if I can manage with just 1 filter in the tank.

[jayc]

HMF is more of a super sized sponge filter that is internal pump driven.

[Kaylenna]

Seee... that is what I considered trying - I've got lots of little spare motors.  @jayc is your foam/holder silicone'd in? 

How powerful a motor do you need? (how many l/h or equivalent?)

[jayc]

3 hours ago, Kaylenna said:

is your foam/holder silicone'd in? 

Not mine, but yes, it's siliconed onto the glass.

 

3 hours ago, Kaylenna said:

How powerful a motor do you need? (how many l/h or equivalent?)

Doesn't have to be too powerful. 500-600L/hr maybe more if you have a 4ft or larger tank.

[Kaylenna]

Just when I think I know what I was going to do with my tanks, I find something like this and now I have to make new plans!  Lol.

I only have small tanks for the shrimp - 2footers.  I need them to be divided, but if I can turn the HMF idea on its side, I ought to be able to create flow across the divider.  Unless someone else has an idea about how I might incorporate such a filter into a divided tank.

Edited September 13, 2016 by Kaylenna

[zn30]

Depends how you divide the tank you could possibly place the filter system along the whole back of the tank (a lot of filter media though) the divider may be able to stop around 25-50 mm from the back, if using glass, and the sponge holds on both sides and set up the system as normal. Otherwise a curved sponge setup in both corners however you would need to push air out of both corners.

Hope you understand what I am trying to say above!

Maybe use one or two of these from @newbreedhttps://newbreedaquatics.com.au/filter-media/sponge-filters I have gone back to these and BioSPON Filters.

[jayc]

You can use the sponge as dividers themselves.

Two HMF sponges in the middle of the tank, with enough of a gap between the sponges for the pump to go in the middle. 

Rig up a "T" valve on the outlet hose to feed water back to the two halves of the tank. 

OR 

Also using the sponges as dividers themselves. 

The pump is at one end of the tank, but the outlet hose goes to the chamber furthest from the pump.

Like this...

 

[Kaylenna]

47 minutes ago, jayc said:

You can use the sponge as dividers themselves.

I sorta had something like the upper option (pump in the middle), but since the tanks are only 2ft wide, it eats up a large chunk of my space.  I was hoping to do a horizontal section towards the lower back of the tank, using the space that is usually somewhat empty because it is too dark to grow much anyway. 

[inverted]

Next question. Where to get poret foam from?

[revolutionhope]

Next question. Where to get poret foam from?

From nz is the only way so far as I've been able to find out. I looked into it recently.@newbreed knows about this he recommended it to me as well.

[Kaylenna]

Why poret foam in particular?  Can't other types of similar density be used? (assuming it's aquarium safe and not going to leech stuff)

[jayc]

From here:

http://fish2water.co.nz/hamburg-matten-filter.php

 

 

Age of Aquariums have some sponge foams and filter mats, but I don't think they are poret.

http://www.aquariumproducts.com.au/filter_media.php?page=5&instid=8130

 

13 minutes ago, Kaylenna said:

Why poret foam in particular?

Poret is just the brand name of the foam.

You can use similar types of open cell foam, if you can find a suitable replacement. The hard part is getting the required size and grade.

For shrimp, you'd want 30ppi (pores per inch) foam, any less and the shrimplets will get through.